Oh wow the more I look into this the more confused I get. I want little bits of each of these cameras, all wrapped up into one.
I currently own a 60D and will be purchasing a new camera to be the main camera for my small business and the 60D will become my 2nd/backup camera.
In short:
7D -- i like the price and ocf solutions that match the 60D (remember its a small business)
6D -- well that would get me into a full frame camera, yay, but is it overpriced maybe?? and apparently its same size/weight/shape as the 60D which i'm used to and like to hold etc
5DMkii -- i like the megapixel size, full frame, the price now that the Mkiii has be out for a while ... and it comes with some good lenses for kit prices, eg 24-105mm
5DMkiii --well need i say more hehe, of course i want this one haha, but if i choose this one i would only be able to afford after market lens brands, and wonder if its even worth it getting such a nice camera to NOT put canon lenses on it.
HELP me, please, all feedback and suggestions will be GREATLY appreciated :))
What lenses do you have? If you have lenses designed for a crop-frame camera (EF-S in Canon terminology) they won't fit any of your shortlist except the 7D, so you will need to factor lens upgrades in.
Also bear in mind that a full-frame camera will show up flaws in lens quality more than a crop-frame camera. Even expensive lenses can be soft in the corners compared to what you are used to, and cheap lenses will be potentially disappointing.
Remember, the quality of the lens is often more important than the quality of the camera in determining the overall results.
Also don't forget to calculate other costs -- out of your selected cameras, only the 6D uses the same style of SD memory card as your 60D. (OK, the 5D3 supports both types, but the SD card performance is very poor and you'd be advised to avoid it). Equally, the 7D is the only camera that has a built-in flash, so if you don't have a flash gun and anticipate ever needing to take a photo with flash, you need to factor that in to the cost of the other three.
@abirkill wow thanks so much for your input alexis :) so do you think the Mkii with the 24-105 lens is ok ? i mean, my concern is that it is technically a superseded model, now that the Mkiii is out, although they seem to still be available widely, that confuses me.
I did not know that about the EF lenses, well i guess i did, i'd just forgotten that it was a factor haha, duh tadii.
when i mentioned the flash thing with the 7D, i meant that it will remote fire a lens the same way as my 60D and as i'm not running a full studio setup i thought that may be as "pro" as i'll get for a while, does that make sense??
love your info above, although it hasn't helped make my mind up haha, more like given it more to consider, ugh, i'll argue this in my head to the death i think.
oh, so your question, yes i currently only have the lenses that come in 60D kits, 24-55 and 55-250 i think they are, and i wasn't planning on using them professionally lol. thats why i thought the Mkii with the 24-105 sounded ok, because i was looking at that lens or a 24-70 anyways. and i'm assuming that they give better deals in "kit" sales.
:)
@abirkill the 24-105 or 24-70 wasn't the ONLY lens i was going to get, but definitely plan on getting one of them, as well as a prime lens, haven't decided which one of those yet either.
If the 5D2 does everything you need, then I'd say that's the way to go. The 5D2 and 24-105mm L lens is a stunning combination, and at the price it's available for today it's definitely by far the best value for quality. The weight is a little higher than the 60D, but you're moving to a heavier package anyway -- the 24-105mm lens is a lot heavier than either of your current lenses, so the actual difference between a 6D and a 5D2 isn't as much as you might expect, when the lens is mounted.
Lens-wise, also don't forget that a full-frame camera means less zoom -- the 24-105mm lens will only zoom in as far as a 65mm lens does on your current camera. This means that if you regularly use the reach of your 55-250, then you will almost certainly want a telephoto lens as well -- the Canon 70-300L would probably be my recommendation, although again it's not cheap. If that's too expensive, the 70-200 f/4L would also be worth considering.
The 24-70mm f/2.8 is a fantastic lens, but is seriously expensive and lacks IS. If you need to freeze motion in low light, it's hard to beat, but for camera shake the 24-105mm with IS will actually give you sharp shots more often.
Don't quite understand your question regarding flash -- if you are using a radio trigger on your 60D to fire an external flash, then yes, that will fit any of these cameras. If you are using the onboard flash to fire an external flash (optical slave sync) then you can't do that as none of the full-frame cameras come with an onboard flash.
yes i knew the 24-70 f/2.8 was very heavy, i've hired one before, and managed ok, so i guess the 24-105 will be similar, or so i've heard. i just didn't want to be purchasing the Mark 2 and have it like be out of date etc. but i guess its still a pretty cool camera hehe. and i hadn't quite realised how MUCH more the 24-70 was, wow lol.
yep i also knew that about the full frame losing zoom, and will get a longer zoom, although i am thinking i'll go 2nd hand or something with that one, just so i can afford it, i figure i use it less so brand new won't be so important.
and yes, that is what i meant, the onboard flash firing the external, and i'd read that it was unique to the 60D and 7D, with the particular instructions i'd had that is.
so, i'm leaning towards the Mark 2 now, thank you so much :)
@bobfoto Indeed, I think they would probably agree that making their EF-S lenses actually extend back into the camera (so they can't fit a full-frame camera without being impacted by the mirror) was not very forward-thinking -- it prevents them providing a crop mode like Nikon can. There really is no good Canon-branded walkabout lens that can be used on both a crop-frame and full-frame camera -- the 17-55mm is great on a crop-frame, but doesn't fit a full-frame, and the full-frame lenses are either not wide enough (24-xx) or not long enough (16-35/17-40).
@taidster No problem -- the 5D2 is out of date, but you can still buy it new, and in the important aspect (image quality) it's expected to be on a par with the 6D. If the 6D features (slightly increased frame-rate, GPS/Wifi, built-in HDR, etc.) are important to you, then that's worth considering -- but the 6D + 24-105 is on B&H at $2900, and is unlikely to drop much this side of Christmas. The 5D2 has been as low as $1499 in the past couple of weeks, and while that's without a lens, that gives you a lot of extra cash to play with!
I am in the same dilemma but am opting for the 6D, because of the newer features, it's better in low light. Plus how cool to be sat inside nice and warm while you take pictures using your phone to control the camera and see what it sees, wicked :D
I have a 5D mk 11 and I am very happy with it - I think the lenses are the most important factor in a camera so I say go for the mk11 and put any spare money into the L series lens. Also I don't think cameras go 'out of date' well, not for a long time anyway - its just the manufacturers trying to entice us with new gadgets !
@taidster I have the 5DMIII and can tell you it is an absolute sweetheart of a body. Going full frame was the second-best decision I made. The best decision was upgrading my lenses to the L series. If I had to choose on a budget, I'd recommend making a prioritized list of your lens upgrades first. Professional fast glass is worth more than the camera body when it comes to quality shots. If that leaves you sufficient funds to go full frame with the 6D, that's fine. Even the 5DMII, which is down significantly in price, is still a fine camera body. In the end, though, I think you'll be more pleased with pro lenses on a full frame body than any other combination.
I had the 5d mark 2 and I loved it. I too wanted the mark 3 but unless you are shooting professional you will never need that kind of camera. Go for the mark 2
@johnnyfrs ummm john, you've piqued my interest on the phone as a remote thing, will have to read up on it now hehe ;)
@stoat thanks debbie, i knew i'd have to put money into lenses, and that probably going to make me choose the Mark 2 at this point i think.
@kannafoot thanks ron...if i can find a good deal i may be able to squeeze the Mark3 but the lens will be the priority now i think.
@ontheotherside rachel, i do intend on using it for my business yes, so i guess i'm a professional now ?? haha, don't feel like one :-/ but i do want excellent quality yes.
@taidster Be sure to consider used equipment from the highly reputable dealers. If you're in the US, both Adorama and B&H Photo sell very high quality used gear that they inspect and rate before putting on the market. With some "Mark II" versions of L series lenses now available, there are some excellent "older" versions out there that can save you significant cash. Just as an example, Adorama has this lens available - the 70-200 f2.8L IS - for $1700. http://www.adorama.com/US%20%20%20%20521284.html (I have that lens in my kit and absolutely love it. Paired with the Canon 2x Tele, it's a phenomenal wildlife lens, too. The IS is an absolute must.) Anyway, keep an eye out there for some great deals.
@taidster how is the hunt for a camera going? I've recently (2 days ago) upgraded from my 7D to the 5D MKIII and I love it. This is the first FF camera that i've owned and I love it. The separation from the background seems alot nicer here.
Personally, I think your choices should be between the 6D (in december), the 5D MKIII and the MKIII.
Get the 6D if you're going to shoot landscapes primarily or even portrait. Dont get it if you're going to shoot alot of fast moving subjects.
The 5D MKII along with the 24-70L lens was for the longest time the go to solution for alot of weddings photographers. Just because the MKIII has come out doesn't make this any less a fab body
Lastly, the MKIII.. what can i say, I love it but cant compare to the MKII as i've never used it. One thing to consider though, is that the firmware allows for micro adjustments for the lenses and applies these as soon as you plug in the lens. This means that even some of the cheap EF lenses look pretty good.
As to remove triggering.. I just dont know if i'd use it.... and I CERTAINLY wouldn't be leaving any kit that expensive outside while i'm inside. On the bright side, you could maybe shoot of some snaps of the thief as he's running away with your new camera? :)
Another quick note... Lightroom 3 does NOT support the RAW format of the 5D MKIII. If you get the MKIII , you'll need to upgrade to LR4. I've just had to do this and while it irritated me at first, the £60 upgrade really wasnt too difficult to stomach after what i'd spent on the new camera body.
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Also bear in mind that a full-frame camera will show up flaws in lens quality more than a crop-frame camera. Even expensive lenses can be soft in the corners compared to what you are used to, and cheap lenses will be potentially disappointing.
Remember, the quality of the lens is often more important than the quality of the camera in determining the overall results.
Also don't forget to calculate other costs -- out of your selected cameras, only the 6D uses the same style of SD memory card as your 60D. (OK, the 5D3 supports both types, but the SD card performance is very poor and you'd be advised to avoid it). Equally, the 7D is the only camera that has a built-in flash, so if you don't have a flash gun and anticipate ever needing to take a photo with flash, you need to factor that in to the cost of the other three.
I did not know that about the EF lenses, well i guess i did, i'd just forgotten that it was a factor haha, duh tadii.
when i mentioned the flash thing with the 7D, i meant that it will remote fire a lens the same way as my 60D and as i'm not running a full studio setup i thought that may be as "pro" as i'll get for a while, does that make sense??
love your info above, although it hasn't helped make my mind up haha, more like given it more to consider, ugh, i'll argue this in my head to the death i think.
oh, so your question, yes i currently only have the lenses that come in 60D kits, 24-55 and 55-250 i think they are, and i wasn't planning on using them professionally lol. thats why i thought the Mkii with the 24-105 sounded ok, because i was looking at that lens or a 24-70 anyways. and i'm assuming that they give better deals in "kit" sales.
:)
Lens-wise, also don't forget that a full-frame camera means less zoom -- the 24-105mm lens will only zoom in as far as a 65mm lens does on your current camera. This means that if you regularly use the reach of your 55-250, then you will almost certainly want a telephoto lens as well -- the Canon 70-300L would probably be my recommendation, although again it's not cheap. If that's too expensive, the 70-200 f/4L would also be worth considering.
The 24-70mm f/2.8 is a fantastic lens, but is seriously expensive and lacks IS. If you need to freeze motion in low light, it's hard to beat, but for camera shake the 24-105mm with IS will actually give you sharp shots more often.
Don't quite understand your question regarding flash -- if you are using a radio trigger on your 60D to fire an external flash, then yes, that will fit any of these cameras. If you are using the onboard flash to fire an external flash (optical slave sync) then you can't do that as none of the full-frame cameras come with an onboard flash.
yes i knew the 24-70 f/2.8 was very heavy, i've hired one before, and managed ok, so i guess the 24-105 will be similar, or so i've heard. i just didn't want to be purchasing the Mark 2 and have it like be out of date etc. but i guess its still a pretty cool camera hehe. and i hadn't quite realised how MUCH more the 24-70 was, wow lol.
yep i also knew that about the full frame losing zoom, and will get a longer zoom, although i am thinking i'll go 2nd hand or something with that one, just so i can afford it, i figure i use it less so brand new won't be so important.
and yes, that is what i meant, the onboard flash firing the external, and i'd read that it was unique to the 60D and 7D, with the particular instructions i'd had that is.
so, i'm leaning towards the Mark 2 now, thank you so much :)
@taidster No problem -- the 5D2 is out of date, but you can still buy it new, and in the important aspect (image quality) it's expected to be on a par with the 6D. If the 6D features (slightly increased frame-rate, GPS/Wifi, built-in HDR, etc.) are important to you, then that's worth considering -- but the 6D + 24-105 is on B&H at $2900, and is unlikely to drop much this side of Christmas. The 5D2 has been as low as $1499 in the past couple of weeks, and while that's without a lens, that gives you a lot of extra cash to play with!
@stoat thanks debbie, i knew i'd have to put money into lenses, and that probably going to make me choose the Mark 2 at this point i think.
@kannafoot thanks ron...if i can find a good deal i may be able to squeeze the Mark3 but the lens will be the priority now i think.
@ontheotherside rachel, i do intend on using it for my business yes, so i guess i'm a professional now ?? haha, don't feel like one :-/ but i do want excellent quality yes.
thanks for a good starting point with US sellers, at least now i can compare with ours here :)
Personally, I think your choices should be between the 6D (in december), the 5D MKIII and the MKIII.
Get the 6D if you're going to shoot landscapes primarily or even portrait. Dont get it if you're going to shoot alot of fast moving subjects.
The 5D MKII along with the 24-70L lens was for the longest time the go to solution for alot of weddings photographers. Just because the MKIII has come out doesn't make this any less a fab body
Lastly, the MKIII.. what can i say, I love it but cant compare to the MKII as i've never used it. One thing to consider though, is that the firmware allows for micro adjustments for the lenses and applies these as soon as you plug in the lens. This means that even some of the cheap EF lenses look pretty good.
As to remove triggering.. I just dont know if i'd use it.... and I CERTAINLY wouldn't be leaving any kit that expensive outside while i'm inside. On the bright side, you could maybe shoot of some snaps of the thief as he's running away with your new camera? :)
Another quick note... Lightroom 3 does NOT support the RAW format of the 5D MKIII. If you get the MKIII , you'll need to upgrade to LR4. I've just had to do this and while it irritated me at first, the £60 upgrade really wasnt too difficult to stomach after what i'd spent on the new camera body.