Okay, having been looking at everyones wonderful shots for some time now I am thinking, and I say thinking, about getting some sort of editing programme...taking the next step, if you see what I mean.
So, how hard is PS to learn? Pros, cons, does being a technophobe have it's drawbacks?
Thing is, I am keen, willing to learn and all that, just think my mumbled jumbled brain won't cope with anything harder than boiled sweet.
The only thing I do with some of my shots is crop them, most of the ones posted here are the same as when I took them.
Mmmm, need a new toy but don't know which one to get. Feel a bit like a child in a sweet shop....too much choice and not enough knowledge..LO
Ok. It won't bite you. It might give you a nasty suck though.
For a beginner, I would go for PS Elements - it can do much of what the full blown product can and isn't too expensive to ditch if you decide it has sucked the life out of you.
Easy / hard to learn... Hmmm. Once you have learned some of the basics it is then up to you how you wish to continue. The basics are easy.
Perhaps if you've done NO editing at all... something very user friendly like Picasa (and also free) would be fun and you could see if you enjoy messing with the photos.
@m9f9l I have played around with Picassa and feel okay with it, use it for making greetings cards, birthday cards and work cards for the children. Just wanted something with a bit more nite to it, something I could have as a challenge.
My suggestion is to live on YouTube for awhile and check out the beginners vids for Photoshop Elements...this will give you an idea of what you are in for. YT is also fabulous for showing you just what these programs can do...so much editing and creative ideas that would never have occurred to me in the first place was possible. Also the vids help you learn about getting an 'eye' for what looks good in a photo because they are often about fixing mistakes. I never knew there was such a thing as chromatic abberations til I saw it on YT lol. Good luck!
For me PS is all trial and error. If there's something I want to create, I google it and 9 times out of 10 I find ways to do it in tutorials either on YouTube or blogs.
Photoshop is a slippery slope, though. I thought that the more I learned, the quicker things would go, but NOPE, haha It's the exact opposite! I can spend a bazillion hours editing a million version of one photo, just for fun. No exaggeration! :P
Seriously, though... editing the photos is the most fun part for me, even more than taking them! My advice is to just think of an idea you want to try and then find some tutorials and go from there.
you might consider Lightroom instead of Photoshop, especially the new version. check its requirements against your OS, though, as version 5 will have far stricter requirements, and will only run on OS X 10.7+ or Windows 7+.
I suggest you try PS Lightroom. You can opt for a 30 day free trial which will give you time to see if you like before you buy. There are also lots of tutorials online to help you get started so you do not feel so intimidated by all the tools :-)
I started to have interest with Photoshop 7 some 3? years ago and it has been a journey, and a fulfilling one at that. I also used Photoshop CS5 and then now, I have Photoshop CS6. If you're up for some nosebleed tinkering and for some hardcore editing power, go for Photoshop. But if you're into ease of use and less clicking here and there, then Photoshop is not for you. But if you're persistent and if you got a lot of time for some online Photoshop expert tutelage, then go ahead and enjoy. :D
Hi Boo. Good question. I can only speak from experience, and my experiences have been with Photoshop elements and Lightroom 3. For a beginner, I would suggest Lightroom as there are already preset settings which you can start with and then tweak. Elements is also relatively straightforward....certainly easier than the full version of Photoshop. IF EVER I NEED TO KNOW SOMETHING, I HEAD OVER TO YOUTUBE (don't know why everything changed to caps, haha sorry... too much effort to delete and retype on my kindle). There are so many amazing and easy to understand tutorials out there!
Different opinions from everyone. I started with PSE and then moved to Lightroom 4 (and PSE for some things) I think that PSE is more intuitive, althought now I have got more used to LR I use it most, but it was a bit of an uphill struggle to feel comfortable with. In the meantime why don't you have a play with some of the free online programmes like Picmonkey and Ribbet and the others mentioned here. They are really simple to use.
I have something of a love/hate relationship with PhotoShop. Some of the things it can do are just fantastic, and I've been able to manipulate some photos in ways I could never have dreamed of otherwise - but I've never had any formal training in how to use it, and as such, I sometimes find myself getting things a bit muddled. I keep meaning to try and enrol on some kind of course - just to get the basics down - but there are always more pressing things on which to spend my money!
If you want to, get hold of a copy, and just start playing around; you can always just experiment, and try out different things! The first few things you try probably won't be great (the composer Gustav Holst referred to this as the "Early Horrors") but trial-and-error, along with tutorials on YouTube and photography websites, can take you further than you may think, if you're prepared to spend a bit of time on it...
To be honest, I probably wouldn't recommend GIMP - lots of people say it's like a free alternative to PhotoShop, but although the workflow maybe fairly similar, I have tried it, and found it very hard to use. I'd consider myself a reasonably "technically minded" type of person, but I though GIMP was clunky and counter-inutuitive, and I didn't really get along with it at all.
Just my opinion on it all, but I hope at least some of that may have helped a bit!
Even if you decide you that it is not for you, you should try it because you will learn more about what goes into making your photo.
Just remember, that there really isn't SOOC unless you take your picture in RAW format. If you are not processing the image then that means that your camera is doing it for you. It is a small computer but it is a computer none the less.
Everything that you will need to know to use Photoshop are things that you probably should know about digital photography.
Here is a list you could do a quick search on:
Levels
Curves
Masks
White Balance (Temperature)
Saturation
Hue
Also, the Adobe RAW editor is well worth getting whatever product that it comes with. I use CS5 currently and love it.
As someone mentioned above, lightroom is Photoshop for photos only. Get Photoshop if you think that you want to do some graphic design stuff as well.
I use Photoshop CS6 because it is the 'industry standard' in my line of work. However to colleagues and friends I recommend Photoshop Elements 11 to those for whom post processing is not a large part of their job.
The major differences between the two in terms of functionality are not of much concern to photographers who do not process to pre-press or use the 3D functionality. In terms of user interface PS CS6 the learning curve is steep and goes very high. PSE less so and there is a lot more guidance and recipes built into the product.
Lightroom is another very good product but I have never got on well with it probably because I have been using Photoshop since its early days and am hard wired into a workflow. I only recommend PSE before it because having made the choice I invariably become the go to tech support for it so there is an element of self-preservation in my advice.
The GIMP has a similar learning curve to full Photoshop but it is free and there is an active user community to provide advice.
Trail 1 or 2 or 3 or even all of them until you find one that suits.
I have to agree with @jwlynn64. Post processing will let you understand what digital photography really is. You might have a magical idea but sometimes your camera just won't let you do or have what you thought you wanted in the first place. Post processing saves the day.
Personally, I don't think that I will ever understand Adobe Lightroom 4.1. A generous friend gave me a copy and I tried it for a day or two and I easily got lost. Beats me, I don't know why. I am more used (lemme say trained, self taught, that is :D) to Adobe Photoshop CS6. But if you don't have the time and the energy, there are a lot of websites that offer great photo editing for free.
What camera do you have? It should have come with some free editing software, and I would start with that to get your feet wet. If you are successful there, then move on to something later if you feel you want to do more. If not, you arent out anything.
Does your camera come with in-camera editing? A Retouch menu? The problem on relying on those resources only is that you only have a small LED screen to see the problems and the results, which is not enough in almost every case.
There are good free editors out there. Picassa is just one. The downside is that documentation is lousy or non-existent. Try Pic Monkey here on 365, nothing to buy, nothing to install. It has basic tone correction capability and is very easy to use. Documentation is next to non-existent though.
Photoshop CS (Creative Suite) 6 is a huge piece of software, and I would not advise anyone to jump into that for your first time out. It is not "hard to learn" or "hard to use" per se (indeed the user interface, or interfaces, are very well done) but it has unique concepts that might appear "difficult" (some say "impossible") if you haven't encountered them before. And literally thousands of features. The plus side, there are so many documentation and tutorial resources available both in book and online, to help you out. The downside, it is expensive (US$600 retail and usually not discounted ever), and requires a powerful PC (multi core, 8 GB RAM and a 64 bit operating system optimally) to run up to snuff.
If you still want to buy something, check out Adobe Lightroom. Not Elements, it just doesn't do enough, even for less than $100, and has the "difficult" PS interface I believe. I am not familiar with Aperture, the other big name in the market.
Don't get me wrong, I use Photoshop all the time and can't think of ever being without it, but I am still finding pieces I haven't looked into before.
Great that you are thinking about editing and post processing to improve your shots. There is not a single shot that won't benefit from some post production. Good luck.
Whatever you decide to buy, USE THE FREE TRIAL FIRST. 30 days for Adobe products.
I have PS Elements 9 and I have not found it very intuitive for me (and I like techie stuff, but I'm always in some form of learning curve). That being said, I have it and I'm determined that after 365 days that I will master the thing. It's about time for me--I have very little. I hear great things about Lightroom.
I have the new version of PSE and an older version. I have found the nwe version very frustrating but as @kazlamont said, you might try YouTube for help. Thanks Kazzy, as I didn't even think of that.
Might be worth looking into but I think you can download Photoshop CS2 for FREE! There was a thread about this but I never looked into it as I have CS5.
another vote for Lightroom. Used PS way back and hated it! Lightroom was such a pleasant surprise.
Now, I can't do alot of the heavy duty photo editing (at least I don't think I can) in Lightroom, but that's not what I want to do, so its a perfect match!
I supplemented LR with the Nik software and have pulled down free programs from the internet for image stacking and to make a collage.
If I do go to PS, I will step slowly through PSE first.
I have PSE 10 and Lightroom 4. I've always had a version of PSE but when I started wanting to do more than just crop and play around I ended up getting a subscription to Photoshop Elements User - that has helped a lot. There are videos and tutorials that are pretty easy to follow.
That being said, since I got Lightroom I've been using it a lot more than PSE. Part of it may be that with the whole picture a day going on I don't really do as much editing or maybe it's that I'm getting a little better at the SOOC part.
Photoshop is a wonderful and powerful program and once you get familiar with it is pretty easy to use. Being a graphic designer I have used Photoshop for 20 some odd years. That being said, I rarely use Photoshop to process my photographs. I use Lightroom and Silver Efex, and love them.
I would recommend trying the free downloads as other have suggested and see which program works better for you. Youtube and Adobe's help site are great resources when you are stuck for how to accomplish something.
I would take Lightroom over Photoshop any day, but then I don't do much to most of my images. I'm using Lightroom 3 which I picked up cheap off ebay when Lightroom 4 came out. Best purchase I ever made.
@huvesaker PS and PSE can be difficult to learn, although you may learn what you want to do most often. I have PSE9 and have learned some parts fo using it, but not enough to use it well. In the past month I have been using Zoner Photo Studio 15 and love it. You can get a 30 day free trial period then if you want to buy the pro-version it is $70. Bryan Peterson recomends this photo processing software. I would encourage you to try it out.
Boo, I've just downloaded PS Elements 11, and bought a book. Now I have to do something with get. If you get it too, we can stumble along together. Ssh, don't tell him but I was wondering whether @steampowered might do another one of his clever video tutorials for some beginners!! did I say that out loud? ;0) @huvesaker
I am not the worlds most technically minded person I have an od version of photoshop and over the last year have learned various wonderful things through trial and error. It is an expensive thing to buy new but just being able to tweak your shots adjust the levels and contrast will give you so much pleasure. Many shots I have taken looked like rubbish until I just tweaked them.Personally I would say go for it. It will open up a whole new side to your photgraphy.
Just wanted to repeat what someone said earlier -- if you're a student or a teacher you can can get a great deal on Photoshop -- less than half the regular price for exactly the same product. Now if I can just get past the beginners' level which I have to do because I'm taking a digital photography class and our final project is to do fancy stuff with Photoshop. Layers! Oh no.
forget the books... think of something you want to do, watch a video tutorial and make yourself do it... i have oodles of books and half the time i don't even know how to find anything in them because i don't know what to look up in the index and i haven't the patience to read an entire chapter to figure out what radius i should use when sharpening something...
Photoshop does need a large learning curve and is hugely expensive if you don't qualify for the educational discount. Try Photoshop Elements. Most people only use a few of the main functions of Photoshop rather than all its bells and whistles, and Elements will give you the necessities (and it's a lot less expensive).
Also, don't be afraid to go for older versions of software. They still do the job, and are less expensive - and often less complex than the most up to date, which is helpful for a beginner.
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For a beginner, I would go for PS Elements - it can do much of what the full blown product can and isn't too expensive to ditch if you decide it has sucked the life out of you.
Easy / hard to learn... Hmmm. Once you have learned some of the basics it is then up to you how you wish to continue. The basics are easy.
Being a technophobe? It might be an advantage!
Course I do ;-) gawd I can't even work the other thing you sent me!
Photoshop is a slippery slope, though. I thought that the more I learned, the quicker things would go, but NOPE, haha It's the exact opposite! I can spend a bazillion hours editing a million version of one photo, just for fun. No exaggeration! :P
Seriously, though... editing the photos is the most fun part for me, even more than taking them! My advice is to just think of an idea you want to try and then find some tutorials and go from there.
@breigh hahaha sounds like something i would do :-)
Also if you're looking for a free alternative to PS, GIMP's a great choice that works similar.
If you want to, get hold of a copy, and just start playing around; you can always just experiment, and try out different things! The first few things you try probably won't be great (the composer Gustav Holst referred to this as the "Early Horrors") but trial-and-error, along with tutorials on YouTube and photography websites, can take you further than you may think, if you're prepared to spend a bit of time on it...
To be honest, I probably wouldn't recommend GIMP - lots of people say it's like a free alternative to PhotoShop, but although the workflow maybe fairly similar, I have tried it, and found it very hard to use. I'd consider myself a reasonably "technically minded" type of person, but I though GIMP was clunky and counter-inutuitive, and I didn't really get along with it at all.
Just my opinion on it all, but I hope at least some of that may have helped a bit!
Just remember, that there really isn't SOOC unless you take your picture in RAW format. If you are not processing the image then that means that your camera is doing it for you. It is a small computer but it is a computer none the less.
Everything that you will need to know to use Photoshop are things that you probably should know about digital photography.
Here is a list you could do a quick search on:
Levels
Curves
Masks
White Balance (Temperature)
Saturation
Hue
Also, the Adobe RAW editor is well worth getting whatever product that it comes with. I use CS5 currently and love it.
As someone mentioned above, lightroom is Photoshop for photos only. Get Photoshop if you think that you want to do some graphic design stuff as well.
@peterdegraaff AGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! :-)
@manek43509 @jwlynn64 thank you for your comments, I shall take them all on board and think carefully. I am glad I asked now. :-)
The major differences between the two in terms of functionality are not of much concern to photographers who do not process to pre-press or use the 3D functionality. In terms of user interface PS CS6 the learning curve is steep and goes very high. PSE less so and there is a lot more guidance and recipes built into the product.
Lightroom is another very good product but I have never got on well with it probably because I have been using Photoshop since its early days and am hard wired into a workflow. I only recommend PSE before it because having made the choice I invariably become the go to tech support for it so there is an element of self-preservation in my advice.
The GIMP has a similar learning curve to full Photoshop but it is free and there is an active user community to provide advice.
Trail 1 or 2 or 3 or even all of them until you find one that suits.
Personally, I don't think that I will ever understand Adobe Lightroom 4.1. A generous friend gave me a copy and I tried it for a day or two and I easily got lost. Beats me, I don't know why. I am more used (lemme say trained, self taught, that is :D) to Adobe Photoshop CS6. But if you don't have the time and the energy, there are a lot of websites that offer great photo editing for free.
Does your camera come with in-camera editing? A Retouch menu? The problem on relying on those resources only is that you only have a small LED screen to see the problems and the results, which is not enough in almost every case.
There are good free editors out there. Picassa is just one. The downside is that documentation is lousy or non-existent. Try Pic Monkey here on 365, nothing to buy, nothing to install. It has basic tone correction capability and is very easy to use. Documentation is next to non-existent though.
Photoshop CS (Creative Suite) 6 is a huge piece of software, and I would not advise anyone to jump into that for your first time out. It is not "hard to learn" or "hard to use" per se (indeed the user interface, or interfaces, are very well done) but it has unique concepts that might appear "difficult" (some say "impossible") if you haven't encountered them before. And literally thousands of features. The plus side, there are so many documentation and tutorial resources available both in book and online, to help you out. The downside, it is expensive (US$600 retail and usually not discounted ever), and requires a powerful PC (multi core, 8 GB RAM and a 64 bit operating system optimally) to run up to snuff.
If you still want to buy something, check out Adobe Lightroom. Not Elements, it just doesn't do enough, even for less than $100, and has the "difficult" PS interface I believe. I am not familiar with Aperture, the other big name in the market.
Don't get me wrong, I use Photoshop all the time and can't think of ever being without it, but I am still finding pieces I haven't looked into before.
Great that you are thinking about editing and post processing to improve your shots. There is not a single shot that won't benefit from some post production. Good luck.
Whatever you decide to buy, USE THE FREE TRIAL FIRST. 30 days for Adobe products.
Here is the link http://www.adobe.com/downloads/cs2_downloads/index.html
Try it out maybe as a dip your toe in? I personally love Photoshop and do a lot of tweeking in it.
Now, I can't do alot of the heavy duty photo editing (at least I don't think I can) in Lightroom, but that's not what I want to do, so its a perfect match!
I supplemented LR with the Nik software and have pulled down free programs from the internet for image stacking and to make a collage.
If I do go to PS, I will step slowly through PSE first.
That being said, since I got Lightroom I've been using it a lot more than PSE. Part of it may be that with the whole picture a day going on I don't really do as much editing or maybe it's that I'm getting a little better at the SOOC part.
I would recommend trying the free downloads as other have suggested and see which program works better for you. Youtube and Adobe's help site are great resources when you are stuck for how to accomplish something.
Good luck!
forget the books... think of something you want to do, watch a video tutorial and make yourself do it... i have oodles of books and half the time i don't even know how to find anything in them because i don't know what to look up in the index and i haven't the patience to read an entire chapter to figure out what radius i should use when sharpening something...
Also, don't be afraid to go for older versions of software. They still do the job, and are less expensive - and often less complex than the most up to date, which is helpful for a beginner.