Thank you to all those who voted for me in the last bracketing Camera Settings Challenge & also to the other participants who put up some great shots. I hope you got as much out of it as I did.
Winning Photo -
Do some of the camera settings intimidate you? Do you want to learn how to develop your photography skills and learn how to use your camera effectively without always going back to the “auto” function? These challenges are for you!
This week’s challenge is: Bokeh!
I did try to convince another photographer to host this new challenge however time was against him & a few days had ticked by so I thought I would take it on myself. With all the Christmas lights out at the moment it doesn’t get any easier than that to really make your backgrounds sparkle.
Explanation:
There is more to creating an image with good bokeh than just pointing your camera at some lights & making them out of focus. Bokeh helps to separate the main subject of the photo from the background and so normally enhances the subject rather than being the subject.
A brief history, bokeh comes from a Japanese word Boke meaning “blur” and is pronounced with 2 syllables Bo – Ke. The spelling Bokeh was created to help non-Japanese speakers to pronounce it correctly.
The 4 main factors in creating a good bokeh shot are:
1. The aperture
2. The distance from your camera to the main subject of the photo
3. The distance from your subject to objects in the background
4. The focal length or zoom.
The most extreme setup for getting bokeh into your shot would be to have a wide open aperture, a short distance to the subject, a long distance to the background matter & your lens on full zoom. That said, pushing the limits of your camera or lens does not always give the best results. For example, lenses often have a softer focus at full zoom or maximum aperture which will affect the quality of your main subject. Using these extreme settings would also be a bad idea if your subject is close to the camera. Putting on your biggest zoom lens at full stretch is going to kill your composition. Lastly, Christmas lights too far in the background will blur out to nothing which is OK if that’s what you are after but keep in mind, more isn’t always more. So play around and find the best setup for what you are trying to achieve
There are 2 types of bokeh. One is known as “Cream Cheese Bokeh” for its creamy goodness and the other is Hollywood Bokeh, noted for its sparkly goodness.
Cream Cheese Bokeh:
Notice the smooth texture of the blur in the background. This is often used in portrait photography outdoors & gives the subject clear separation from the background.
Hollywood style Bokeh:
This is an image of a fibre optic lamp with little red points of light at the end of each strand. The strands in front of and behind the point of focus (F/2.8 aperture = small depth of field) have that familiar round bokeh shape.
Additional Tips (optional):
If you want to push yourself a little harder, Hollywood style bokeh techniques can also be used to create shaped bokeh. The round shape we usually see is due to lenses having a round aperture ring. You can achieve results like these two images with a little DIY creativity.
The fish swimming in a jar photo was taken with a homemade lens cap with a fish shaped hole in it.
I am really looking forward to seeing some great bokeh shots. I predict it will be very difficult to pick out 5 finalists but that’s my problem not yours. Your job is to make it harder for me.
Helpful Links:
What is Bokeh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRJMisfK_-Q
Walkthrough: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPcdWxhLwoA
Shaped Bokeh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zENUI8n0Rtw
Experienced photographers who are knowledgeable in this particular setting are encouraged to offer “kind and constructive” suggestions on the posted entries. Those entering this challenge want to learn and improve.
This challenge starts today (and normally lasts 10 days but I am going to throw in a couple of extra days because Christmas will no doubt wipe out a couple of days in the middle, and runs until 30th December 12:00pm Central Standard Time (17:00 Zulu time http://www.zulutime.net). All photos must be taken during these dates to be considered. Enter as many as you would like- the idea is to practice & learn. TAG YOUR PHOTO CSC-18 AND post your picture in this thread to receive feedback from other experienced photographers specific to this challenge.
Voting will take place 31st December (and remain open 24 hours) and the winner will be announced next year (ha, I can say that because it’s true). The winner of the challenge will select an experienced photographer to host a new challenge. It is the winner’s option on who they want to host the next challenge; it may be someone they follow whose work they admire, or someone who is active offering suggestions on previous CSC challenges. The winner may also select an experienced photographer for the list of photographers who have agreed to host future challenges as another option. Here is the link to that list: http://365project.org/myhrhelper/365/2011-12-12
Expect to receive constructive suggests on how to improve your skills.
How to post your photo on this link:
1) Go to your page that has the photo you wish to post.
2) Copy the “share” code in the bottom right section of that page.
3) Return to this thread and paste the code under comments
Yeah! Sounds fun and my last attempt at bokeh was nothing to get excited about.
Here is my question:
Since you mentioned that aperture is part of it what type of settings should we look for? I have two lenses 55-200 and 18-55 the aperture for those lens don't get very high. Any suggestions?
@myhrhelper The lower the aperture the easier it is to achieve the bokeh effect. So that should be your starting point. If you can get the shot you want with the 55-200 you will also make it easier on yourself.
In a low light situation, if the best your lens will do is F/4 and it's still too dark, then you need to compensate for that by decreasing your shutter speed (you may need a tripod) or increasing the ISO (which will increase noise).
I am not a Nikon guy but I see you have a D5100. If the equivalent priced Canon is anything to go by, say a 650D, then ISO1600 is going to be right on the edge of tolerable noise. ISO800 or less will be better. So then decrease the shutter speed to get a shot that works.
I hope that answers the question.
I learned from a get pushed challenge how difficult even plain hollywood bokeh can be if you're using a lens that doesn't do better than f4.5. However, once I put my 75-300 lens on, I was able to do it, but I'm the last person to ask for tips on achieving the bokeh (although cream cheese bokeh is relatively simple). @grizzlysghost is the go to guy for bokeh questions. Because hollwood and shaped bokeh are such a challenge for me, I *might* participate in this one to get more practice in.
@myhrhelper I thought some more about your question. You were probably wondering how to squeeze some decent Bokeh out of a lens that won't go down to F/1.8 or so. It is not a problem when you get the distance right between the lens & the focal point and also the focal point and the background. My photo for today was shot at F/5.6 & 300mm. The distance from the lens to the decoration was about 3ft & to the background another 2 feet & it's more like the bokeh is over done than under done. Have a look at the clip "What is Bokeh" in the helpful hints section above, I think it will help.
@chapjohn If I can suggest, I see you have shot this at 30mm. You might be able to pump up the cream cheese bokeh effect by moving back from the flower & zooming in if you have the equipment for that. It should give your flower a bit more separation.
@mandyj92 my advice would be..see if you can use a focal point of your image which is noticeably different from the bokeh. I think it is difficult to distinguish the foreground from the background so the shapes loose their impact.
@david68 I used a 30mm prime macro lens for this shot. Any zoom would be with my arm reach or feet. Would I get more seperation if I toned down the green leaves as background?
@chapjohn yes perhaps but I was coming at it from the bokeh camera settings challenge angle. It you want to get both flowers in shot AND you can't reposition to increase the distance from the flowers to the background then perhaps the 30mm prime is not the best way to get creamier bokeh. I see you were at F/2.8. If F/1.8 or better is an option on that lens then that would also help.
OK so I'm having major isssssues here trying to do the shaped bokeh. Two questions. Firstly, how does the size of the cut-out affect the outcome? And then how do I get the outlines of the bokeh crisper? What things affect the crispness? Does shutter speed make any difference? Maybe if I knew this I could work with what I've got (no 50mm lens) and see how good I could get it?
Thanks David.
Here is my first attempt for the challenge. i had different plans using a bokeh shot and a poinsettia which involved layering (which needed erasing the unwanted parts) but to my disappointment Picmonkey no longer allows me to select my own photo (need a paid account)! Then I went to Ipiccy and it doesn't allow you to errase. So those funky layering photos are not an option for me at this time :(. So I did something totally different than what I planned. So I went a bit crazy and perhaps I will delete but here is my abstract Christmas Poinsettia w/bokeh
I call this the air or by sea collection (butterflies or fishtails)
@wildernesswillie I think you should try and get a distinct foreground and background. Also there seems to be some camera movement in your 8sec shot. Have a look at the "What is Bokeh" link under helpful hints in my original post to get an idea of how the distance relationship between the camera, the point of focus & the background relate.
From what I can see the star you have made should work fine if the other factors are in place.
@myhrhelper That is a creative take on the challenge. If you want access to layers for free you could download Gimp. It is a steep learning curve but there are squillions of YouTube tutorials to help you learn the ropes. I think Gimp is one of the most amazing free programs available.
To figure out what size to make it, take the focal length of your lens and divide it by the size of the aperture. So, a 50mm lens with an aperture setting of f2 would give a figure of 25mm and your shape would have to be smaller than this. A 125mm lens with an aperture of f2.8 would give a figure of 44.5mm:
ie, 125÷ 2.8 = 44.5 (approximately)
A 75mm lens with an aperture of f4.5 would give a figure of 16.5mm (approximately):
ie, 75÷4.5 = 16.5
You can use a craft knife to cut your shape, or you could try using a shape punch if you want something more crisply cut or intricate.
@grizzlysghost I heard you are the bokeh guru. David is doing an awesome job on this challenge and we are learning a lot. Feel free to add any additional knowledge on the subject if you wish.
Thanks
@myhrhelper Haha, thanks Kathy (though I am far from a "guru")! I've read through the posts and to be honest, there isn't more that I could possibly add; outstanding information!
@david68 Hi, David, I have one thing to add that I learned recently when I was preparing the shot below (which does not fall into the dates of this challenge): "I learned an important lesson tonight: I had very DIRTY bokeh. My 100mm macro lens does divine things with light, but when the bokeh looks like protozoa are swimming in it, something is definitely wrong. It turns out the protective filter glass on my lens was filthy. . . " I had been so disappointed with some of my bokeh shots because of the little imperfections - what a relief to find that cleaning the filter made the difference!
@david68 Thank you David. I managed this with f5.6 on my kit zoom lens (at 154mm). I probably could have fiddled with the length more and maybe got sharper ones, but I was a bit limited for space. 2 things I worked out - the lights on the edges of the frame were always only part shapes, must be to do with the lens shape. So I had to bunch up the lights to be in the centre of my frame and I actually cloned out one stray. Also the other important thing was that I got no success at all until I had a faster shutter speed. This was 1/13. Otherwise I got too much fuzzy light around the shapes. Interestingly now I've looked at the other bokeh shots, a lot of the nice crispy ones have a similar or faster shutter speed. This is probably obvious to other people, so maybe didn't need mentioning in your tips, but I'm not that with-it lol!
Oh and re the size of the shape. This Xmas tree punch was big - 2cm across. Not sure if that fits that maths equation but it made successful bokeh shapes with my lens/aperture combo.
And the colour? this was taken of plain lights and then tinted.
And now I'll be quiet ;-)
This is my first try at shaped bokeh. It was a lot easier than I thought to make the lens cap. Of course I cheated and used a die cutter to make my shape. this is just a shot of the Christmas Tree. I agree with @tulipgirl, the faster shutter speed helped with the sharpness of the shape. I also noticed, since I have a full shot of bokeh, that only the shapes in the center are whole. On the left side of the photo the right wings are cut off and on the right side the left wings are cut off. I thought at first that it had something to do with the curve of the tree but not sure about that?
One of the articles I read stated that you should make sure that your lens cap should be loose enough for the camera to focus. That definitely is true. I had to keep taking the cap off to focus since I didn't want the camera to focus on the lights. I think I will try cutting some holes in the side of my lens cap so I can manually focus without taking it off the lens.
The Christmas Tree is one of the prelit ones. Way too many lights.
I would love to know how to do better bokeh. I think the fact that I can only get a 3.5 aperture and have an 18 to 50 mm lens has something to do with it. I see some amazing pics on here. (oh, and don't even get me started about how noisy my pics are.) Anyway, Any advice would be helpful.
@elizabeth264 With what you have said I would use these settings:
1/ A shutter speed 1/20th sec or faster
2/ Zoom to 50mm
3/ ISO800 or less (to reduce noise)
4/ F/3.5
5/ set the subject as close to the lens as it can focus on.
That will give you 2 variables.
Ambient light & the distance from the subject to the background.
Keep increasing the ambient light until you get the exposure right. If you can't, choose a different location.
Then work with the distance from the subject to the backdrop. Find a way to increase & decrease this until the bokeh is good.
I am confident if you can work with that you will get close to what you want.
@elizabeth264 in the original post I had a list of 4 settings but I left out zoom to 50mm so I edited the post. Also, I am doing this on an iPhone & typed updates instead of updated. Sorry for the confusion
@david68 hey, maybe you can help with this.. I CAN"T get a 3.5 f stop if I am zoomed to 50 mm! I can only get 3.5 if at 18 mm. When I am at 50 mm I can only usually get 5.6 or something like that. i think that is my problem. i once googled that i couldn't get an aperture of 3.5 with my nikon lens and it said that you had to zoom out to 18 mm.
I know exactly what you mean so that lens is 18-55 F/3.5-5.6. That is no problem. Use f/5.6 & compensate by having the background further away. You can also try @ 18mm & work on the shot composition to make it work. I suspect your waterbowl shot would have been close to that & the composition is good.
Here is my second try at decorative bokeh. I got the focus on the angel but I believe that the distance from the angel to the lights was not correct and my speed was not fast enough to get sharp edges. Also in other testing I never could get perfectly round shapes. The bulbs are in a ceramic tree and most of the bulbs are photographed from the side rather than the top. I think that is causing the oval shapes and some of the blur.
@lstasel Hi, all other things being equal, you could increase your shutter speed if you increase the ambient light when you take the photo.
Sharpening the edges of the bokeh will decrease the size of the dots which will reduce the overlap & perhaps mean you won't want to change the distance to the background, perhaps but you have to experiment.
That said, it is your photograph & there is nothing wrong with having those soft edges & overlaps if that is the way you want it, it's just another effect which I think still works.
I am traveling at the moment & can't do better than look at this on my iPhone but, it does seem there is a bit of noise in the bokeh & the angel is a little underexposed. If that is the case, increasing the ambient light will brighten up the angel, allow you to lower the ISO to reduce noise & increase the shutter speed to sharpen the bokeh.
Hope that helps.
I wanted to use this potpourri ball a few days ago, but couldn't think of anything to do with it. I thought I'd try again tonight against my kitchen backspash. I was surprised at the result. I am very interested in your thoughts....thanks...
I have been working on bokeh - it fascinates me. I'm so new to photography that I've been confused as to how to get it to work. This is my second submission for this contest. I'm really interested in your thoughts. Thank You...
@geocacheking These are nicely balanced shots. deliberate or otherwise, the coloured lights in the Leon shot appear to make the steam for your train. I clicked through to your page & saw the title which explained the typo. Very funny.
@kizzysmom I like the ball image for its simplicity. The colour tones are all pretty close & then there are only 2 lines to think about, the curves (leaf shape & the ball) & the rectangles in the background. The tiles are a bit like shaped bokeh without all the messing around with cardboard lens caps.
I like the second one too. It reminds me of a bokeh sandwich. 2 layers of Cream Cheese Bokeh goodness on the outside wrapped around a crispy sharp sea shell in the middle.
@lstasel Hi Laura, I am back from my trip now & I have had a chance to look at this on a proper monitor. I was clearly wrong about the noise so ignore what I said there (lucky I explained about the iPhone). I still think lightening up the angel slightly could give it a bit more punch. It is a good image though that would make a nice Christmas card cover.
@david68 Thanks David. I agree about lightening up the angel, especially the face. On my monitor the photo looks perfectly exposed but the bright lights in the background draw your attention away from the angel's face. Your first thought about the noise was correct. It is there but is not too bad. I have an older camera so noise is an issue in low light.
Here are a couple more from yesterday and today. They look well exposed on my monitor which is a very bright graphics monitor but look much darker on the Mac.
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Here is my question:
Since you mentioned that aperture is part of it what type of settings should we look for? I have two lenses 55-200 and 18-55 the aperture for those lens don't get very high. Any suggestions?
In a low light situation, if the best your lens will do is F/4 and it's still too dark, then you need to compensate for that by decreasing your shutter speed (you may need a tripod) or increasing the ISO (which will increase noise).
I am not a Nikon guy but I see you have a D5100. If the equivalent priced Canon is anything to go by, say a 650D, then ISO1600 is going to be right on the edge of tolerable noise. ISO800 or less will be better. So then decrease the shutter speed to get a shot that works.
I hope that answers the question.
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Works best if you have a 50 mm lens (or other fast lens) opened all the way up to f/1.8 or as big as you can go.
Cream Cheese Bokeh (brown leaf in background)
Thanks David.
I call this the air or by sea collection (butterflies or fishtails)
From what I can see the star you have made should work fine if the other factors are in place.
http://gilly-walker.com/2011/12/create-your-own-bokeh-shapes/
To figure out what size to make it, take the focal length of your lens and divide it by the size of the aperture. So, a 50mm lens with an aperture setting of f2 would give a figure of 25mm and your shape would have to be smaller than this. A 125mm lens with an aperture of f2.8 would give a figure of 44.5mm:
ie, 125÷ 2.8 = 44.5 (approximately)
A 75mm lens with an aperture of f4.5 would give a figure of 16.5mm (approximately):
ie, 75÷4.5 = 16.5
You can use a craft knife to cut your shape, or you could try using a shape punch if you want something more crisply cut or intricate.
Thanks
Oh and re the size of the shape. This Xmas tree punch was big - 2cm across. Not sure if that fits that maths equation but it made successful bokeh shapes with my lens/aperture combo.
And the colour? this was taken of plain lights and then tinted.
And now I'll be quiet ;-)
One of the articles I read stated that you should make sure that your lens cap should be loose enough for the camera to focus. That definitely is true. I had to keep taking the cap off to focus since I didn't want the camera to focus on the lights. I think I will try cutting some holes in the side of my lens cap so I can manually focus without taking it off the lens.
The Christmas Tree is one of the prelit ones. Way too many lights.
1/ A shutter speed 1/20th sec or faster
2/ Zoom to 50mm
3/ ISO800 or less (to reduce noise)
4/ F/3.5
5/ set the subject as close to the lens as it can focus on.
That will give you 2 variables.
Ambient light & the distance from the subject to the background.
Keep increasing the ambient light until you get the exposure right. If you can't, choose a different location.
Then work with the distance from the subject to the backdrop. Find a way to increase & decrease this until the bokeh is good.
I am confident if you can work with that you will get close to what you want.
Sharpening the edges of the bokeh will decrease the size of the dots which will reduce the overlap & perhaps mean you won't want to change the distance to the background, perhaps but you have to experiment.
That said, it is your photograph & there is nothing wrong with having those soft edges & overlaps if that is the way you want it, it's just another effect which I think still works.
I am traveling at the moment & can't do better than look at this on my iPhone but, it does seem there is a bit of noise in the bokeh & the angel is a little underexposed. If that is the case, increasing the ambient light will brighten up the angel, allow you to lower the ISO to reduce noise & increase the shutter speed to sharpen the bokeh.
Hope that helps.
I wanted to use this potpourri ball a few days ago, but couldn't think of anything to do with it. I thought I'd try again tonight against my kitchen backspash. I was surprised at the result. I am very interested in your thoughts....thanks...
I have been working on bokeh - it fascinates me. I'm so new to photography that I've been confused as to how to get it to work. This is my second submission for this contest. I'm really interested in your thoughts. Thank You...
I like the second one too. It reminds me of a bokeh sandwich. 2 layers of Cream Cheese Bokeh goodness on the outside wrapped around a crispy sharp sea shell in the middle.
Here are a couple more from yesterday and today. They look well exposed on my monitor which is a very bright graphics monitor but look much darker on the Mac.
A more natural bokeh. Needed a little more dof.
and