Hi Joce. For the TT: It is strictly based on number of favs the photo accumulates from Wednesday to Wednesday. So it really doesn't matter if the photo is a quality one or better than other people's.... Just on how many friends you can get to fav it. I get sad for the website now because there seems to be a trend that some members fav every photo they see, in return for those same people to come over and fav yours. For example, I have been on the site for 4 years and have faved a lot of photos in those 4 years. About 7000. When I realized I was faving that many, I slowed down my faving. It is not a "favorite" in my opinion if you give out hundreds of favs and to the same people daily, day in and day out. Some people have been on the site a year or two and have 15,000-28,000 photos they have given favs to. Many people have left 365 for that reason. It keeps some great photos off the TT. And I do not mean my own! I did make the TT 2 or 3 times, but I have never felt I have that many potential TT pics. I feel bad for the people who take excellent photos but do not do this type of faving thing because their pics do not make the TT. The PP is a formula based on favs and how many followers one has. That tries to level the playing field for people who have low follower number. The TP is for pics that pretty quickly gather a few favs.
@espyetta interesting observation about the favs... i try hard not to fall into that trap... and then end up in this funny conundrum... someone has 10 comments on their photo and 10 favs... it's a good photo, but i've seen better of that thing, and i know the photog CAN do better... so now i think... am i the first person to comment and NOT fav? or do i not comment at all so i don't ruin their streak? and really, i need to remind myself that this is NOT what 365 is supposed to be about... but sometimes, it seems as though it is...
@espyetta@northy I agree with you both. There are many brilliant photos with characters outside TT and PP from people who explore outside the formula and take risk. I hope there are a page outside TT and PP to let them shine. I value my Fav folder, so I protect it from being overflow, those are photos that I would love to go back to appreciate again.
@northy unfortunately so... Getting fav's and praising comments is all people seem to want here. At the beginning of my project here I tried to give some critique as well, but that didn't seem to get me anywhere. So I've then simply stopped commenting pictures I don't like for some reason..
Oh, and I hate hate hate "follow for follow"- comments, in every social media site. I follow if I like. That might mean I'm a cold person or something, but I can live with it.
@tande@yaorenliu@northy@paula365@tande@amandal@jocee
Some of us sort of think that this all started about the same time that people joined and immediately started a discussion on the boards "please follow me, please tell me what you think about my photos." It seems people only wanted to get on here to get favs and "acclaim" whether is is warranted or not. Some of us wanted to learn about our cameras, learn to be better photographers, and make friends/connect with people all over. I guess we can still do that. We just will have to ignore the other "stuff."
Oh this is a tricky one! As a relative newcomer to photogrpahy and conversely 365 it is a huge encouragement to see your photograph on the Trending or Popular Page. It gives you a positive high to know that people are liking your images. I recently had three images on the PP at the same time and was 'proper chuffed'. I will never get a photo on the Top Twenty (as much as I would love one) and I wonder whether it is something I should personally strive for or just accept the day to day community and support that this wonderul site offers.
@motherjane hah! I never thought I would make the top twenty... But eventually i did... Although not in the last year or so... But that's ok... My goal is quality... Even if it's stuff that doesn't resonate with most... I've learnt a lot (A LOT!!) here and am so grateful for those who've shared tips and provided constructive criticism....
@motherjane I've never been on TT and doubt I will too! Personally for me this site was the push I needed to continue with my photography. It's been more than I dreamed the site would be.
After reading through this i went and looked at how many favs i have, been here since january this year, 1229 favs.... So averages about 3.8 / day. .... Not bad i guess? I try to remember to keep it down, most of the time i just dont have time to sit and look through them all, let alone clicking fav.
PP, TP, and TT are awesome when they happen, but I still know which of my own photos I think are great, whether they get "noticed" or not. Sometimes I'm surprised when someone favs something I thought was pretty lousy, or when I post something I think is one of my best and it goes by with hardly a comment. You can make yourself crazy if you focus too much on the "popularity" aspect... it's much more rewarding to just keep doing your own work, participate in the challenges, and let people fav how they want to fav (or not). I was stressing myself out way too much when I was trying to take something with popular page potential every single day. I'm much happier now doing my own thing and not worrying what other people might think about it.
@motherjane I doubt I will ever make TT but like you I feel as if I am on the right lines if I get on TP or PP. The standard of photography on this sight is incredible and if I get remotely near to being any where near as good I will be amazed. But i am also here to improve and feel that this is happening because of the encouragement form other 365ers @polarvrtx I absolutely agree you took the words right out of my mouth
I guess the point about faving is that you should only fav photos that you think are good or that resonate with you. I’m afraid some people have figured out the numbers game and are faving as way to increase favs on their own photos. I’ve been fortunate enough to have a couple of photos make it the TT and considered it an honor, and it should feel like an honor. And it’s unfair to work the numbers in your favor so some deserving photo never makes it. I love this site, and I just want to keep its integrity intact.
@northy Sometimes when there are 10 comments and 10 favs it is not always the person who leaves the comments who has given them. I too am delighted if I get on the TP or PP but do not expect people to fav my pictures because I do theirs. I fav only those as @lisabell said, that resonate and I love going back to look at them every so often. There are so many good photos that I would be there all day clicking the fav star that i am fairly selective. I enjoy and appreciate the comments, especially critique and information sharing. I started this year too and strive to improve and challenge myself in the supportive environment here by looking at others techniques and using feedback to up my game for myself. However if one of my pictures happened to fall on TT... oops I have just seen a pink pig fly by! ;-)
@motherjane@denisefuller@polarvrtx@lisabell Yeah, I do not have a problem with people faving a photo or being super excited to see their pics on the TP, PP, or TT. I have had pics on all three, and it is very exciting. It is totally normal to want to see your photo on those pages, to be excited to get a fav, or to fav photos. There IS something wrong with faving every photo one sees...so that the people you fav come back to put a fav on yours. Or making fake accounts. Or getting family and friends who do not post photos to come on and fav your photos to drive up your fav numbers. I was once in a final five for a theme challenge. I mentioned it on facebook when I linked over my photo that day, and a friend on Facebook said she'd come over and join 365 to vote for my photo in that challenge. I asked her please not to...that would not be ethical, since she did not do the project. And, in my opinion, some people just care too about favs too much. They have made getting on the TT a "job" to work at instead of working on improving the photography. To me, when someone is constantly going back to people who said "Fav" on their photo, but did not really hit the "fav star button" (so the fav did not register)...and ask them if they could they please try again to hit fav. That seems a bit too focused on the fav/TT. But that is just my opinion. And I too, love this site. I want it to stay the quality site I joined in 2011.
I think it's partly "Facebook mentality" too... sometimes I want to "like" something but not necessarily "fav" it... you know what I mean? On Facebook I'll go through my feed and "like" all kinds of things, for all kinds of reasons. Some people might see the "fav" button as a "like" equivalent and go around faving everything they appreciate, not just the top tier stuff. For that kind of stuff I usually leave a comment saying that I like something without faving it, but like @northy sometimes I feel like a jerk to be like "Wow, I think this is great!" and then not also fav it. "Wow, this is great! But, you know, not THAT great..." ;)
@polarvrtx@northy Yeah, I know what you and Northy mean...but I guess I now stop and make myself be more selective. And just because others love it doesn't mean you have to. I am still taking the time to comment, so I must like it. Right? Haha And yes, on FB, you just hit "like" to communicate you saw it...but I hope no one does that on this site. "Hey I saw your pic." Yikes. I guess that is why it gets discussed from time to time on here...WHY does one fav? And everyone gets on and talks about it. Lately, I have noticed a correlation between TT appearances and how many favs that photographer has given out. Not on all of them, of course. But some. That was not always the case.
@espyetta wow, MaryBeth I couldn't have said it better!! The TT means nothing if the same names keeps on appearing!! It's like looking at the same kind of shots weekly....
If I don't seem impertinent (and I hope I don't!), I'm wondering if "this shift" is a result of FaceBook mentality. I've steered clear of that genre of social media as I don't "want" 400 new friends with whom I have nothing in common. I joined 365 because I was with like-minded photographers...have the opportunity to assist some and I can look to others for assistance. It's foolish to hang our hearts on a popularity contest as it trivializes our efforts. Actually, some of the very best work (IMO) is posted by photographers with no great desire to communicate with others, yet even from some, I've received some nice assistance when I asked. Personally through my affiliation, I think I've risen to a notch above mediocre, but that leaves me lots of time to keep after it. I'm pleased if suddenly a photo I myself like makes it to the TP. I'm often surprised if I happen to notice my picture was on the PP. I'm appreciative, but my sense of Self doesn't rise or fall by that measure. I get long-winded, I know, but I'm so glad to be a part of this community, for both the personal connections that happen as they would in a classroom setting (and, what to me, can feel like a classroom if I wish it to be.) Aren't we fortunate to have made our way here, and I'm ever appreciative to Ross @scrivner for making this quality site available to all of us who see daily life through a lens.
@espyetta tx for that Mary Beth... but really, i don't mind not being "popular"... i've always preferred the offbeat and quirky and "popular" is a bit of an antithesis to that i think...
@espyetta Have skimmed through this thread but have been having the same thoughts about people faving every photo, especially when obviously its actually a bad photo. I fav pics I really like, make me laugh or a technique I want to use later, or idea etc. I don't fav or comment for a fav or comment in return. I've had a few pics on the TP with less views and favs than another, better (in my opinion) photo which didn't make the TP. I'm still flattered but it just doesn't make sense.
@espyetta I think you have raised some really valid points. There are usually some stunning photos on TT, but recently I think there have been some mediocre ones that have clearly got there because of the number of favs rather than the quality of the image. In my two years here I have faved slightly more than I've posted, but I won't fav just because I've received a fav, but I will try and visit all that comment on my photos. I have learned SO much from SO many people on 365 and I really appreciate all the help I've received............but I have to confess I haven't even looked at the TT this week :(
@espyetta@joeyc Yeah, I guess that's the thing... being on the TT means nothing if you manufactured it! I've been lucky enough to make it a few times on the merit of the photos (presumably, lol) but if I got on just because I had a bunch if friends fav it, well it just wouldn't mean much to me. I've never felt obligated to go fav the photos of people who fav mine, so I didn't even realize that was a thing! I'd much rather the favs be genuine, although it's totally fine if some people have a lower bar than others for what constitutes a fav. I don't want to discourage faving.
I think some people are faving everything they look at in hopes that enough people will in turn fav their pictures, which helps them to the TT. It has nothing to do with the picture they are faving, it is all about themselves.....hoping for that fav in return. I really don't know how that can be fulfilling.
I suppose this is like so many things in life, people figure out how to work the system. And there are a few here who are working it to perfection.
@Weezilou well said Louise. I concur with the Facebook mentality. I have had quality interactions with my smaller group of followers and have actually had the pleasure of meeting a few in person. I have also grown as a photographer since I first joined this site. . . I mean I have at least figured out how my camera works! And I feel much gratitude for this site.
Interesting. I have no issues with the popular page as it fairly accurately shows who is popular but I'd love the TT to showcase the very best work on here. That's not to say that there isn't great work on it, a lot of the photographers that appear on a regular basis are fantastic and the images wonderful. However, there are many amazing images that just won't make it. I am not sure that it would be possible to look at every image to select 20 every week though!! It is a very friendly and helpful community and it has certainly prompted me to take more photos, which was my hope when I began!
@kporte I agree Keith. PP seems to be almost "right." It has some issues, but is more in line with what seems right. TT is not entirely right. But I know Ross does not have time to go through hundreds of photos to pick 20 that he thinks are the top quality on the whole site. And if he did, people would give him grief. I guess nothing can be done about TT if people choose to stay on the website all day, fav a certain group of people's photos, and build up up to 15,000 to almost 30,000 favs in their "photos they have faved" list. So I guess we all just deal with it and move on. I will continue to love love love your BUG and SPIDER macros! Haha! They rock!
Well, I don’t think this was the intent of the original post, but since this discussion has veered off in a different direction I feel compelled to comment. I had actually thought of starting a post on this, but decided to let it go at the time, so here are my thoughts on this:
1. The first year I joined 365 all I wanted to do was commit to taking at least one picture a day and thus become a better photographer. It was not about garnering FAVs, having followers, or winning themes or challenges. It is a contract you make with yourself and you follow through, and if you succeed at that everything else is a bonus. I followed people whose work I admired, learned from them, was thrilled when someone followed me back, but did not expect it as a return favor, made some wonderful friends near and far, and was stoked when I unexpectedly won a theme after I figured out how to tag my photos!! So, what is it with the recent “Need followers, and friends….follow me and I will follow you back….let’s scratch each other’s backs” threads?! Common guys, let’s get real, what exactly happened to earning followers either because your work is decent, or you have taken the time to comment on other people’s photos? Let’s earn respect!
2. My other pet peeve is the people who decide to follow you one day, and when they do they tell you to follow them back!! If I follow someone it is because I think their work is great, and I am really interested in having their daily posts in my feed. If they do follow me back because they like what they see that’s great, but I would NEVER ask them to do so in a million years. However, they ask, you follow them back, then they drop you like hot potatoes because they got what they wanted, and when you stop following them they come back again. If you stop commenting or FAVing their photos they actually write and ask you why you have stopped! They don’t care if you have a death in the family, if your house is on fire, if it is flooded, if you broke both your arms, it is all about them!! And, yes, these are the same people that get on TT with mediocre photos, all because they have amassed a following based on their tactics, and strong arm people into following them or FAVing their photos on a consistent basis.
3. Now, regarding the original post, frankly I think TP and PP are fine. I don’t really know what the algorithm is for either one of them, but I am glad TP exists because more people are getting the recognition and having their photos seen by many. PP has become more unattainable, but it does reflect quality, and it is always a thrill to get on that page, and to look for work to admire and people to follow. TT has been disappointing lately. There is still some good work there, but there are also some really mediocre photos, and it certainly reflects the reality mentioned before. It is a shame because there are some great photographers who don’t play “the game”, and do not get featured there, while others rise to the top. So, let me ask the million dollar question: is there a prize that I am not aware of for the person that gets the most FAVs every week?! And, if it is not about the money or about having your photo featured in a gallery or photography publication, then what is the fuss all about? Is it that the one with “the most toys” wins?
Let’s get back to what this is all about, our passion for photography that unites us. I would like to see TT be full of work that I admire and aspire to. If I ever get on it, I would like it to be because I have finally reached a pinnacle and created something I am proud of, not because I have traded FAVs for FAVs.
Just my two cents’ worth…..Feel free to disagree, but I am glad I got it off my chest, and I can now focus on what is important, and that is taking pictures and improving my photography skills.
I started on 365 two years ago, I wanted to learn how to take better pictures. Occasionally I get advice like crop it more, or to try a different camera setting. The best challenges are the pair ups each week which I had to stop doing. I met some great photographers this way.
@panthora Very well said Osia on all three points, I couldn't agree more.
I don't think there is anything more I can add to to this thread, apart from talking about my experience.
When I started 365 in Jan this year, I worked hard at finding people whose work I enjoyed and have continued to comment on their posts everyday when life allows it. As a result I feel that I have gotten to 'know' the people I follow to a large extent. I have even gotten to the point where I seldom follow anyone new, as I feel that I already have plenty to keep me happy! That doesn't stop me from exploring the site though and commenting on folk who I don't follow.
For me the TT and PP are great when they happen and I must admit that when I first started I did try hard to get onto them. As I've settled in my project, I have become more confident with my own style and have enjoyed trying out my other peoples themes and my own. I participate in the challenges when I can and just relax. I haven't yet made the TT, but I'm not really fussed about it. I do notice though that the TT does seem to feature the same people every week, with an occasional visitor! I've stopped looking at it to be honest.
With regard to the fav's I must admit that I did fav a bit when I first started, but now the image really needs to talk to me in some way. I find myself irritated when I see a discussion post asking for followers and the like, and this particular topic of how to get onto the PP and TT. I can see that others do too! @espyetta@tande@northy@yaorenliu
I did this project for my own sense of achievement and for making sure that I took a shot (or more) everyday, so for taking photos! I have met some awesome people here from around the world who are very supportive and who have a sense of humour that comes out in their work and their comments. Long may this aspect continue on 365!
Back when I started in 2011 I gave out favs much less frequently than I do now but I feel that I am following so many fantastic photographers that I find it hard not to fav something I truly like. Therefore my fav folder is probably filled with my favourite photographers.
I also feel it's not right how some people fav absolutely every photo they look at, that is really devaluing the fav so when those people fav my photo I think, have you even looked at it as you hit that button. I've discussed this with my family and I think there should be a limit on the number of favs you can give in one day. If you use up all your favs today... say 3 to 5... then you need to come back tomorrow to fav that shot if you truly like it. That would sure knock the numbers around wouldn't it?!
Don't get me wrong, I too have loved my shots appearing on TP, PP and TT but it seems to mean less now than back in 2011 when I had one shot for the whole year make it to TT. I also don't want to take away from anyone on the TT because it does get filled with beautiful photos, I just feel for the ones that take amazing photos but never get featured there.
@northy I bow to the same pressure... I don't want to be the first to not give a fav if everyone else has. I think "well, obviously it's really good".
@april16 Hi April... I see you are new here. TT is the Top Twenty photos of the week. As far as we can tell it is based on the number of FAVs that you get on your photos taken and posted that week. Here is the link for this week: http://365project.org/blog/official-top-20-chart-week-231
@panthora@bella_ss@pixiemac@dibzgreasley@fullcircle@kporte@lisabell@paula365@polarvrtx@pixiemac@debbie3108@northy@denisefuller@Weezilou@yaorenliu@joeyc@zosimasy@callymazoo thanks guys, for the input. It is good to at least know there are like minded people on the site who notice this too. I am sure there are many others who feel the way we do but are too afraid to say anything. After someone "sort of" brought this up on a TT comments thread area a while back and tagged Ross @scrivna he did ask for any suggestions as to how to make it better, but also be something he can possibly do. I was going to ask him if he could limit favs as was just suggested up there now in this thread. Maybe 5 per day. Or do not limit favs but let people know if you exceed a weekly amount you are not eligible for TT. But I think the same thing would happen... Some users would just give their 5 to the same people day in and day out. People like us would scatter them out because we see so many great photos on the site. It would lower the number needed to get on TT but not sure it would solve the problem.it might though because if they could only give away 5 favs I think other photos that do have this huge "fav" following could have a chance to gather enough favs.... It would level the playing field. But aren't websites always needing "more clicks" to prove activity or something? So limited favs would limit clicks. If you have any ideas. I want to reiterate that I do not say any of this thinking my photos need to be on the TT! They do not. I say it for the artistic and wonderful photos that deserve to be there but are being kept off.
@espyetta yes - nice to know there are others :). I think I read once that on Flickr after you've been explored two or three times in a short period of time you're banned from making explore for a couple months... No clue if it's true or not... But it's one way to make room for others, y'know?
I also want to thank those who've come out of the woodwork to post on this topic...
@espyetta mmm, I don't know the answer, but once I realised it was going on I stepped back and don't automitcally oblige them with a view, comment or fav unless I really think it deserves one. Like everyone I have a regular following of people who comment on mine and I do the same, we have a converstion, ask questions, offer advice, tips, encourage. I think we all just need to be aware its going on, step back and not fall into the trap, and enjoy it.
@northy to me it would not even have to be a "ban" so much as a procedure .... People know up front that this has been a problem so we are going to limit TT showings to one a month
@espyetta@northy , I don't post much anymore, just once a week in thepaulaproject, but I always come back to look at the TT. All of the photos on the TT used to be top notch, something to aspire too. It's just not the case anymore. Rather than saying wow, I say how? There are so many fantastic pictures posted to this site, I would like see more of those represented on the TT.
@panthora well said I agree and quite frankly I've been amazed by some of the shenanigans that have been mentioned. The photography is what its all about and like you i would like to be followed because my photography id improving
Just one more note on this, and I am going to let it go....last night when I was commenting on the feed of a person I follow, I saw this remark to her from one of the "FAV mongers", which pretty much sums it up:
"BTW, I was just realizing that you don't visit my project even though I comment and FAV yours.,. and that reduces the interest on visiting yours. I think the project works nicely on reciprocity."
I literally cringe when I see something like this. This is very manipulative, it borders on intimidation, and it does not belong here. When this person did the same thing to me when I was going through a difficult time and not commenting much, I stopped following her. I do not like being coerced into things, and I did not need this kind of pressure, but not everybody reacts the same way.
I think there should be a place where this kind of behavior is reported, and the person warned, and if they persist they eventually be banned.
@panthora wow! I'm just gobsmacked that someone could say that, I'm glad I haven't come across anything like that. For me personally I try to reciprocate just because I appreciate someone taking the time to visit my pics, however sometimes it's just too hard. If I comment on someone's photo it's because I want to and not so you will owe me. Very soon I will be taking a step back as this is my first complete year despite being here since 2011.
@espyetta@northy I think a limit to TT appearance would be a great thing, even if it just dropped to one per week instead of two. I also think there should be a limit per day for faves. It would definitely make me more picky.
@panthora omg! that's awful! really really awful... it makes me sad to think this is happening here... but then, i recall very similar discussions to this one back in 2012 when i started... so even then, there were fav for fav things happening... have to say i've always valued most those friends and followers who dole out the favs with some discrimination - because then it actually means something, y'know?
@bella_ss@espyetta much as putting limits on number of favs and TT appearance may help, it would still sadden me to see too many rules being imposed... that's one thing i appreciate about 365 - not too many rules, and yet for the most part, i think people behave quite decently... the Facebook mentality is clearly there for some - but not all...
and poor @jocee - so sorry for hijacking your thread... i wonder if this is where one should offer up some cake (which is what used to be done when a PP thread got posted... at least it was good for comic relief ;p)
@jocee Yes. I am with Northy! So sorry, Joce, for taking your thread on a run around the paddock! I think it just comes bubbling out when the TT is brought up. Maybe we will have to get her some cake, @northy!
and Northy, I know what you mean. I am not usually one that asks for any "leveling of a playing field." I also do not like a lot of controls. Maybe it was enough for some of us to just clear the air....and move on.
@amandal@tande@paula365@espyetta@northy@yaorenliu@newbank@zosimasy@polarvrtx@denisefuller@lisabell@callymazoo@joeyc@Weezilou@debbie3108@polarvrtx@summerfield@kporte@panthora@fullcircle@dibzgreasley@pixiemac@bella_ss@april16@debbie3108 THANK YOU all for taking the time for your replies. I understand now how it all works. Please don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to end up on these pages more than i have the couple of times, a couple of times i ended up on trending and once on popular, just was not sure how it all worked. I am here on 365 to be inspired by others and learning new techniques, and having fun seeing different things from around the world that i would never see if i hadn't joined 365. I feel bad that i ended up on these pages cause i see so many more beautiful work of art of others that deserve these pages more than i do. I do my share of commenting and faving but now i will watch how i do this, maybe this is how i got on there by many people being nice and faving even though my work did not deserve it, which i do believe it did not in reality. I'm not sure what more to say. I just want to have fun here. Although i was inspired to be on those pages, i really don't care that i never be on one again. Once more a BIG THANKS to all of you. I love this community and i will keep having fun with my passion behind the lens, being inspired, learning from others and hoping i do the same for anyone else on 365. Have a great evening/day everyone. PEACE !!
@northy@espyetta Northy and MaryBeth don't worry !! I don't mind, i don't see this as hijacking, everyone has the right to vent. I don't want cake but i'm curious to know what cake is all about. LOL!! I love this community. I'm learning everyday thanks to many great people like you.
@jocee I just read your post above the last one you did to Northy and me. Oh my! We were not referring to anything you had done nor do we pretend that we can tell you how to feel about getting on those pages! OF course you felt excited! We all do! We were not talking about that or you. I thought your first question was simply to ask because you were curious. Nothing more than that. So I just answered how one gets a photo on each page. That just brought out the stuff about how some people swap favorites to get enough to get to the Top Twenty, which a lot of us have had issue with. And mostly, we were discussing the TT ..not the Trending or Popular pages as much. PLEASE, let me say my apologies to you. The last thing we want to do is run off a new 365-er who is excited about posting on this site!
What @espyetta said... Welcome to 365! The occasional PP and TT issues aside, this is a wonderful community... Full of folks interested in photography - not bragging rights... :D. Don't let a few bad apples and the occasional bit of grumbling spoil things for you!
Yep! That is why I am still here...four years later....I LOVE this site! It is the best if you want a "diary/journal" type format with easy to find posts from your past life! And it is wonderful for making friends. IF you want to learn, it is a great place for that too. I *heart* 365! So for that, thanks @scrivna Ross!
@espyetta Thanks for your reply MaryBeth !! I am not at all offended. My reply is the way i really do feel, that many others deserve the spots on these pages more than me. Don't worry at all please. We are all here to have fun.
@espyetta@espyetta@jocee Yeah, sometimes it's good to have a little say and move on with cake and wine... I'm not much of a baker ;-)
I agree Northy, it is hard to make too many rules as there will always be problems with whatever new rule is applied. I too love this site and am never one to speak out so will probably regret that I did... c'est la vie.
Joce, I'm sure your shots were very deserving of being on those pages. The more you appear on PP the harder it is to get there and that's one way of showcasing different people so there's no need to feel you weren't deserving.
@jocee Same here Joce as @espyetta says above re this not being directed at you, sometimes someone posts a comment here and it kind of mushrooms lol. Welcome to 365, this really is a wonderful place to be and I'll be rolling into year 3 soon. I still haven't got over the thrill of getting a picture on PP. Ross @scrivna has created an amazing community.
@jocee Joce, your photos are lovely, and well deserving of recognition. Thank you for starting this thread, even though we all hijacked it. This truly is a wonderful community, incredibly supportive and helpful, and with an amazing sense of humor. Welcome onboard....looking forward to your photos, and following. :-))
@panthora 'She took the words right out of my mouth...!' Funny, I did not realise that there was such a game playing and am shocked at teh comment you found. I fav rarely if the photo speaks ot me but not because others fav mine.
And I actually did not realise that TT existed for months but have only looked at it about 3 times.
Photography, learning new skills and getting constructive feedback and meeting lovely virtual people is what it is about for me. I have found a hobby I love (even though the repetitive small movements have given me tennis and golfers elbows recently, lol) And I might have managed to convince my husband that I am interested enough to get a macro lens for Christmas. :-) I find it really exciting when someone new vidits and comments and I look at their wok and find people on here with great stuff that I had not known existed. And now I must walk the dog before work!
I joined 365 nearly six months ago and I love it. I joined in order to have the opportunity to learn and to study other peoples images. I knew nothing about photography and the more I learn the more there is to learn.
My real pleasure on this site has been the amazing number of followers who have been really helpful in providing constructive criticism and been equally helpful when answering questions I've asked.
I think the TT, PP and TP pages are set up to be as fair as they can be and there will always be people who have different aims. Mine is to learn and if my images end up these pages it's a bonus.
Sorry just realised this is slightly off track when Joce only wondered how you got not these pages!!
@bella_ss@pixiemac@panthora@callymazoo@thistle THANK YOU all for your kind reply. Now lets have cake and wine and move on to having lots of fun!! Have a great day/evening and happy shooting and capturing everyone !! Peace !!
@panthora Thank you Osia !! I am very happy to be here. Yes it truly is an incredibly supportive and helpful, community with a great sence of humour. I'm learning everyday from many great photographers like you. Cheers to a great day !! And thanks for following my project.
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Oh, and I hate hate hate "follow for follow"- comments, in every social media site. I follow if I like. That might mean I'm a cold person or something, but I can live with it.
Some of us sort of think that this all started about the same time that people joined and immediately started a discussion on the boards "please follow me, please tell me what you think about my photos." It seems people only wanted to get on here to get favs and "acclaim" whether is is warranted or not. Some of us wanted to learn about our cameras, learn to be better photographers, and make friends/connect with people all over. I guess we can still do that. We just will have to ignore the other "stuff."
@polarvrtx I absolutely agree you took the words right out of my mouth
@espyetta tx for that Mary Beth... but really, i don't mind not being "popular"... i've always preferred the offbeat and quirky and "popular" is a bit of an antithesis to that i think...
@polarvrtx yep... exactly :D
I suppose this is like so many things in life, people figure out how to work the system. And there are a few here who are working it to perfection.
1. The first year I joined 365 all I wanted to do was commit to taking at least one picture a day and thus become a better photographer. It was not about garnering FAVs, having followers, or winning themes or challenges. It is a contract you make with yourself and you follow through, and if you succeed at that everything else is a bonus. I followed people whose work I admired, learned from them, was thrilled when someone followed me back, but did not expect it as a return favor, made some wonderful friends near and far, and was stoked when I unexpectedly won a theme after I figured out how to tag my photos!! So, what is it with the recent “Need followers, and friends….follow me and I will follow you back….let’s scratch each other’s backs” threads?! Common guys, let’s get real, what exactly happened to earning followers either because your work is decent, or you have taken the time to comment on other people’s photos? Let’s earn respect!
2. My other pet peeve is the people who decide to follow you one day, and when they do they tell you to follow them back!! If I follow someone it is because I think their work is great, and I am really interested in having their daily posts in my feed. If they do follow me back because they like what they see that’s great, but I would NEVER ask them to do so in a million years. However, they ask, you follow them back, then they drop you like hot potatoes because they got what they wanted, and when you stop following them they come back again. If you stop commenting or FAVing their photos they actually write and ask you why you have stopped! They don’t care if you have a death in the family, if your house is on fire, if it is flooded, if you broke both your arms, it is all about them!! And, yes, these are the same people that get on TT with mediocre photos, all because they have amassed a following based on their tactics, and strong arm people into following them or FAVing their photos on a consistent basis.
3. Now, regarding the original post, frankly I think TP and PP are fine. I don’t really know what the algorithm is for either one of them, but I am glad TP exists because more people are getting the recognition and having their photos seen by many. PP has become more unattainable, but it does reflect quality, and it is always a thrill to get on that page, and to look for work to admire and people to follow. TT has been disappointing lately. There is still some good work there, but there are also some really mediocre photos, and it certainly reflects the reality mentioned before. It is a shame because there are some great photographers who don’t play “the game”, and do not get featured there, while others rise to the top. So, let me ask the million dollar question: is there a prize that I am not aware of for the person that gets the most FAVs every week?! And, if it is not about the money or about having your photo featured in a gallery or photography publication, then what is the fuss all about? Is it that the one with “the most toys” wins?
Let’s get back to what this is all about, our passion for photography that unites us. I would like to see TT be full of work that I admire and aspire to. If I ever get on it, I would like it to be because I have finally reached a pinnacle and created something I am proud of, not because I have traded FAVs for FAVs.
Just my two cents’ worth…..Feel free to disagree, but I am glad I got it off my chest, and I can now focus on what is important, and that is taking pictures and improving my photography skills.
I don't think there is anything more I can add to to this thread, apart from talking about my experience.
When I started 365 in Jan this year, I worked hard at finding people whose work I enjoyed and have continued to comment on their posts everyday when life allows it. As a result I feel that I have gotten to 'know' the people I follow to a large extent. I have even gotten to the point where I seldom follow anyone new, as I feel that I already have plenty to keep me happy! That doesn't stop me from exploring the site though and commenting on folk who I don't follow.
For me the TT and PP are great when they happen and I must admit that when I first started I did try hard to get onto them. As I've settled in my project, I have become more confident with my own style and have enjoyed trying out my other peoples themes and my own. I participate in the challenges when I can and just relax. I haven't yet made the TT, but I'm not really fussed about it. I do notice though that the TT does seem to feature the same people every week, with an occasional visitor! I've stopped looking at it to be honest.
With regard to the fav's I must admit that I did fav a bit when I first started, but now the image really needs to talk to me in some way. I find myself irritated when I see a discussion post asking for followers and the like, and this particular topic of how to get onto the PP and TT. I can see that others do too! @espyetta @tande @northy @yaorenliu
I did this project for my own sense of achievement and for making sure that I took a shot (or more) everyday, so for taking photos! I have met some awesome people here from around the world who are very supportive and who have a sense of humour that comes out in their work and their comments. Long may this aspect continue on 365!
I also feel it's not right how some people fav absolutely every photo they look at, that is really devaluing the fav so when those people fav my photo I think, have you even looked at it as you hit that button. I've discussed this with my family and I think there should be a limit on the number of favs you can give in one day. If you use up all your favs today... say 3 to 5... then you need to come back tomorrow to fav that shot if you truly like it. That would sure knock the numbers around wouldn't it?!
Don't get me wrong, I too have loved my shots appearing on TP, PP and TT but it seems to mean less now than back in 2011 when I had one shot for the whole year make it to TT. I also don't want to take away from anyone on the TT because it does get filled with beautiful photos, I just feel for the ones that take amazing photos but never get featured there.
@northy I bow to the same pressure... I don't want to be the first to not give a fav if everyone else has. I think "well, obviously it's really good".
I also want to thank those who've come out of the woodwork to post on this topic...
"BTW, I was just realizing that you don't visit my project even though I comment and FAV yours.,. and that reduces the interest on visiting yours. I think the project works nicely on reciprocity."
I literally cringe when I see something like this. This is very manipulative, it borders on intimidation, and it does not belong here. When this person did the same thing to me when I was going through a difficult time and not commenting much, I stopped following her. I do not like being coerced into things, and I did not need this kind of pressure, but not everybody reacts the same way.
I think there should be a place where this kind of behavior is reported, and the person warned, and if they persist they eventually be banned.
@espyetta @northy I think a limit to TT appearance would be a great thing, even if it just dropped to one per week instead of two. I also think there should be a limit per day for faves. It would definitely make me more picky.
@bella_ss @espyetta much as putting limits on number of favs and TT appearance may help, it would still sadden me to see too many rules being imposed... that's one thing i appreciate about 365 - not too many rules, and yet for the most part, i think people behave quite decently... the Facebook mentality is clearly there for some - but not all...
and poor @jocee - so sorry for hijacking your thread... i wonder if this is where one should offer up some cake (which is what used to be done when a PP thread got posted... at least it was good for comic relief ;p)
and Northy, I know what you mean. I am not usually one that asks for any "leveling of a playing field." I also do not like a lot of controls. Maybe it was enough for some of us to just clear the air....and move on.
(i'd somehow managed to totally forget the magic monkeys!)
http://365project.org/discuss/general/17395/tt-and-pp http://365project.org/discuss/general/16350/how-is-the-most-popular-for-the-week-calculated http://365project.org/discuss/general/16726/how-do-photos-get-into-the-popular http://365project.org/discuss/general/16785/popular-page-entries
I agree Northy, it is hard to make too many rules as there will always be problems with whatever new rule is applied. I too love this site and am never one to speak out so will probably regret that I did... c'est la vie.
Joce, I'm sure your shots were very deserving of being on those pages. The more you appear on PP the harder it is to get there and that's one way of showcasing different people so there's no need to feel you weren't deserving.
Now, where is that cake and wine?
And I actually did not realise that TT existed for months but have only looked at it about 3 times.
Photography, learning new skills and getting constructive feedback and meeting lovely virtual people is what it is about for me. I have found a hobby I love (even though the repetitive small movements have given me tennis and golfers elbows recently, lol) And I might have managed to convince my husband that I am interested enough to get a macro lens for Christmas. :-) I find it really exciting when someone new vidits and comments and I look at their wok and find people on here with great stuff that I had not known existed. And now I must walk the dog before work!
My real pleasure on this site has been the amazing number of followers who have been really helpful in providing constructive criticism and been equally helpful when answering questions I've asked.
I think the TT, PP and TP pages are set up to be as fair as they can be and there will always be people who have different aims. Mine is to learn and if my images end up these pages it's a bonus.
Sorry just realised this is slightly off track when Joce only wondered how you got not these pages!!