Hi everyone, something strange has been going on and I am not sure if this has ever happened to anyone here before. I just don't get it and would like to hear your input.
I followed someone who was following me as I thought the photos were out of this world and I loved them. Amazing narratives matched perfectly, in fact I was dumbstruck.
After a while I noticed that these gorgeous photos and narratives were probably created with the help of Ai. I confronted the photographer and my comment was immediately deleted. Others who thought the same had their comments likewise deleted.
After some discussion, I then unfollowed said person.
I have also been unfollowed and the photographer has gone private which is rather sad.
I have never experienced this in my seven years on 365. Does anyone have any similar experience?
Ai is changing the way we see things, but it does not mean that it is wrong. I just don't get it that one cannot be honest about it and admit it.
Sorry, it really upset me but now my rant is over and I will smile again. Thanks to a friend 😊
I still think the images are beautifully done. I hope said person reads this and knows what 365 is all about.
Photography, friendship and honesty. A happy place and a lifeline for many 🙏🏼❤
oh no, I'm so sorry you had that experience.
I agree - if AI is used it should be explicit.
AI is a tool. I hope it doesn't impact your experience here too much Diana, because this really is my happy place, and I know it has been yours too.
yes i unfollowed quietly when i realised they were AI images, and not because they were AI but because there was no acknowledgement of the fact. My son has started doing some art using AI and explained to me the work he puts in to get the results he gets so I think there is a lot to learn about it. There are others I follow who state when they use it and I dont have a problem with it. anyone using photoshop etc now for editing is using AI in some way .
I agree with @kali66 on this, it is the non-aknowledgement that images are AI that is
Main problem. Having said that, I have no idea how to recognise AI images, how do you know? Also I wonder if total AI images can be called photography?
I am so sorry you had such an upsetting experience. I agree with what everyone has said about acknowledging the tools used. In addition, I love learning through the knowledge people share about the tools & techniques people use. You expressed it so beautifully…
“Photography, friendship and honesty. A happy place and lifeline for many 🙏🏼❤”
Very sorry, Diana. It's weird that said person couldn't admit it. LOL! I always tell what I've done, if not in the narrative - then in the tabs. They shouldn't have been nasty about it! Shame on them!
Wow, that is so surprising...and yes, I think there is a difference between straight photography with some tweaking and processing and digital art which is more than a mere tweak and now we add AI. Three different skills, three different art forms. All to be recognized as such.
Wonder if the narrative was AI too?? Not worth worrying about Diana, if they're a tit-for-tat follower or commenter, they're not committed and will probs leave 365 and try out somewhere else, like PhotoCrowd
sorry it has upset you . It seems as if the photographer might have been a bit insecure. There is no shame in using any available tools to create our photos unless one denies the use of those tools. Most people here are very understanding of that
So sorry Diana that you had this unpleasant experience. I believe in the particular posts you mention, the narrative may have been also AI generated. While I enjoy looking at AI generated images they are not per say photographs (at least not for me) and I agree that AI generated images should be marked as such.
@ludwigsdiana yup, I saw those photos too. I was quite in awe until I started looking through the rest of the content and realized it all looked way too good to be true. I agree, you should be upfront about how you are creating your images.
I am not familiar with the photographer or photographs in question, but for me the whole idea of NOT using AI is so that my skill as an artist improves. Letting the computer do all the leg work somehow diminishes that. Some effects are AI generated but the picture is still mine- I took it and I'm making the artistic choices to alter it. I like what Amy said- if you look at the photo and it looks too good to be true, it probably is too good to true! If "your" photo is computer generated, you should be up front about that. I'm sorry this person couldn't be honest about their images- but if they couldn't be honest about their pictures, what else were they lying about?
while most use AI to some extent in post processing, if it is used extensively to create and unreal photo it should be stated. others use this platform to show their artwork but it is stated as such ie. watercolors, neurographic art, drawings etc, I guess I don't understand why you wouldn't state that it was that kind of art. to pass it off as a real photo is not right just like using someone else's photos and claiming they are yours isn't right. there are definitely groups where you can openly showcase this type of art if you need the validation. hopefully they will find one. so sorry you were upset.
I believe that AI is a tool and should be acknowledged. I have started with a photograph of a print ( https://365project.org/joysabin/365/2024-02-12 )then will use various edits to create something different than the original. There isn't any shame in using various tools in photography but in my humble opinion, I don't think that hiding behind any tool is the right thing to do.
it is such a shame, it is a tool that can be used but the fundaments of what we do should be doing on this platform is photography. Great that you tried to engage and get a conversation going, but in the end all you can do is provide the opportunity to talk - it's up to them if they want to take that up.....
@30pics4jackiesdiamond@corinnec never occurred to me that the narratives were A I as well ! But now you mention it ...I admit i never read one right through, too long @allsop I realised the portrait was AI because the hands were gooey, (AI cant render hands accurately.... yet ) then the penny dropped. .
Its possible he passed his own base photo through an AI generator just like using a filter
@summerfield I used to think that about Photoshop Vikki!!
Top of TT this week is an image put through an app, it's AI, using a photogger's base image, but still AI. People download cartoons from social media to their feed here, ( and many more fav them so they get on PP!).
AI is a tool many more will adopt as an art form and it be as acceptable as Snapseed, Photoshop, Ribbet, Affinity etc al.
@30pics4jackiesdiamond I find that all legitimate and legal as long as it is mentioned, which my friends here do.
My issue is only about denial and dishonesty. A few questioned him about it and got their comments deleted, that is not the spirit of this site in my eyes :-(
@allsop You would have to follow him if you want to see his work as his photos have all been removed from public! Am I allowed to mention his name here or will I be sued ;-)
@ludwigsdiana I am definitely not going to follow him. This discussion has, however, caused me to think about my own photography and just where my boundaries of acceptable practices are. Food for thought.
Oh dear it is a sad situation. I too think if a photo is manipulated in any way it should be recognised. I recognise the person you mention as I commented on his photos too and have now been unfollowed when I asked if they were AI.
I didn't actually follow him I just saw some of his photos but I think he did follow me briefly.
@30pics4jackiesdiamond I think the photo you mentioned as being on the top of the TT this week was mine. I did take the original photo and then played with it in photo fun. I think the link is https://funny.pho.to/amazing-photo-frames/
and I mentioned that when I posted the photo.
I posted other photos in pho.to fun too and gave a link to the original photo.
I hope you don't think I was trying to deceive anyone with my photos.
That would be the last thing I would do
I occasionally play with my photos in photoshop using Gavin Hoey's tutorials too and I always give a link as to how to do them. ie Little Planet, Mirror Boxes and 3D orbs all using Gavin's tutorials.
I don't have a problem with AI but as everyone here says it should be recognised as such.
I do enjoy looking at some of the creative photos on this site and the fact that people share how they are created too. It is an amazing site and I have been here a long time.
I might add that I don't think Photoshop is AI it is just a tool to play with my photos, but I do recognise that Pho.to fun is a form of AI using my photo. which is why I add the link.
@onewing Babs, you did, and it's a fab edit! I wasn't being critical, just acknowledged the use of AI/app as being popular here in response to Vikki's comment. 😊
@onewing I for one am ever so happy that you do play around and let us know how you achieve a certain image. You have motivated quite a few of us to try things out.
I too love faffing and have learned so much through the links you pass on, thanks fo doing that :-)
It's interesting that you mentioned this today. I was sending a Valentine greeting to my neighbors using Blue Mountain (I've been a member for years) and for the first time the site asked me if I wanted AI to write the message for me (um, no thanks...I've been doing that myself for many decades) I have a feeling I'll be seeing more the AI thing from now on...ugh...
AI doesn’t really bother me, what’s scary and frustrating nowadays is the SCREENSHOTS…!Lots of “so called artists” this day do this… they screenshot your images,alter it a bit by PS or any apps available for editing…without you knowing,…it’s already displayed in galleries with out the consent from the original owner.. and the screenshooter earns fame and profit$ by using your originals.
I saw two of my screenshots photos in FB way back,the person who copied them used to be here on 365..( now her acct.deleted) I confronted her and she doesn’t give a f**knmn😡such a KAREN!!
I'm pretty sure I know who you are talking about. His photos and narratives were really amazing to look at and read BUT it was obvious something else was going on with the images. To me they looked like something out of a Disney animation. Beautiful but over the top and not something that came from a camera! I noticed he's no longer posting! No problem with AI as long as you're upfront about your process!
@linnypinny@bluemoon@joemuli How sad that our wonderful hobby has turned into something else. I am saddened no end of all this scheming and what I call thieving.
After all, we are just normal human beings following a passion. It is such a pleasure seeing something we would like to share with friends, knowing that they appreciate the moment. Most of us are in the same boat, and this site is the perfect way to show what you love about mother nature.
I have no problem with anyone who sees it different, just say what and why you are doing what you do.🙏🏼
@30pics4jackiesdiamond Jackie don't be disheartened, it is all about integrity and if we as individuals stick to our own principles and maintain our own integrity in pursuing our hobby then we won'go far wrong. This group somehow gets under your skin and it is in its own small way important to us in one way or another; for me it has provided a lifeline during a particularly difficult time, and a shoulder to cry on at times, for which I am most grateful. Keep smiling😊
Just thinking this through for myself (and I haven't done enough research) ... To me, the difference between what I do and AI, is that I start with my own image.
Photographers have always manipulated images, whether it's filters screwed onto the front of lenses, or dodging and burning in the b&w darkroom. AI allows you to instruct the program, your creativity is not involved - you don't even need to supply an original image to produce something - it just pulls images out of the cloud - images that could have been "scraped" by a bot from any image sharing site. I apply techniques to MY work, Corinne C put on a beautified squirrel yesterday, John Falconer put up the AI surreal couple, we all fiddle around with WWYD, there's the In the Darkroom group - and loads of you accept a challenge to develop your skills and widen your understanding. But the thing is, WE put in the work. Where is the value if eg @30pics4jackiesdiamond had simply typed in "give me a chopped vegetable flying through the air" ??
@allsop@anniesue@onewing oh dear, all I did was reply to someone on the thread, saying once upon a time I thought PShop etc was cheating and soon AI will be seen as ok.
Wish I'd concentrated more in English Language lessons a century ago at school to be more articulate.
@30pics4jackiesdiamond Ha ha sorry if I sounded a bit snappy Jackie. I have been following you for years and I think last night I was feeling a bit sorry for myself. I have a few medical issues that keep me from being as mobile as I normally am and I had a rough day yesterday and was feeling a bit sorry for myself. Better today after a good night's sleep though.
I am having to resort to more Photoshop photos like little planets and also I play with Pho.to fun occasionally at the moment because I can't walk far. I am 75 years old and for the first time in my life I am feeling old. It will get better when I am mobile again. Hope we are still friends because I love your photos and comments. I see it is your birthday too, so Happy Birthday, but I won't sing, you don't want to hear me sing. I could bake you a cake though. ha ha.
Used to refer to an overly demanding or entitled middle-class woman.
A “Karen” is generally depicted as a high-strung, rude woman. A common example is when someone is rude or abrasive towards customer service workers, this person might be called a Karen.
Each person's project is their own. If they are satisfied posting AI on a photo site, then that's on them. Anything besides SOOC is processed and AI is just another technique. I don't have to like it nor do I have to follow someone whose project uses it regularly.
@wakelys I was very reluctant to start this Susan, I was just so upset that I needed to share this dishonesty!
Of course I use Photoshop and other apps to try and improve my photos. I am old, shaky and need a bit of help 😁
I love this group and am delighted to be part of it 😍
@joemuli
I think I need to change my name! 😆 This is definitely not a name I'm too thrilled to be the owner of if that's what it all implies (in the various links).
@ludwigsdiana
Thankfully not - that would really motivate me to take a trip to the lawyers to do some serious name changes 😂
Interesting subject you’ve raised here; I am no fan of the blatant misuse of AI. I know AI is now prevalent in just about all editing apps, Lightroom included, and I have no problem with AI helping me mask a subject or the sky in order to enable me to fix the lighting or colour or do whatever other fixit-editing work; but when folk use midjourney and enter a couple of prompts, come up with a good-looking image entirely from prompts alone and lead others to believe it to be a photograph they captured; that is something I have serious issues with. It’s a blatant lie - why lie about something like this?
And it’s actually quite troubling, this whole AI business; I’ve sometimes got to the point whereby I seriously question the originality of an image. Is this for real, or is it a very cleverly done AI piece of photographic-looking art? Or someone else’s image they swiped off the internet and dollied up with AI? Some folk are very good at it, they know how to make an AI piece look really authentically photographic.
It’s a complex subject - it’ll be interesting to see how it all pans out over the coming months/years.
Sorry for the long post; I tend to ramble on and on.
(ps - I hope this is not what ‘karens’ are prone to doing! 🤣 )
@cocokinetic Oh no, Karen is a good name. I think of two things when I think of Karen, firstly the incomparable and tragic Karen Carpenter, her voice! Secondly and quite differently the Karen ethnic and faith group see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_people
@ludwigsdiana
No, no reason other than that I think just don't know what Im doing in these settings - when I look at my profile, I see stuff. Mind you, there's not much there to begin with - but let me fiddle around and see what I've gone and switched off when it should be on.
@ludwigsdiana
Ive just set project privacy to public to all - hope that does the trick.
Actually, thinking further, when I'm off photo-mode and quit the photography thing for a bit, not posting much - there are times when I set everything to private. It's just a small thing I have about public forums, and oftentimes when I start posting again, I forget about these settings and don't remember what I've changed, and what's showing and what isn't.
@allsop
Thank you for this most interesting information! The Karen people in the wiki article make for absorbing reading. Who would've thought there's an ethnic group of folk called Karen? Fascinating. I so much appreciated reading this, thank you!
And yes, Karen Carpenter. She's one of the legendary people in the music world one just never forgets about. Fabulous voice, and a wonderful countenance about her.
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I agree - if AI is used it should be explicit.
AI is a tool. I hope it doesn't impact your experience here too much Diana, because this really is my happy place, and I know it has been yours too.
Main problem. Having said that, I have no idea how to recognise AI images, how do you know? Also I wonder if total AI images can be called photography?
“Photography, friendship and honesty. A happy place and lifeline for many 🙏🏼❤”
@allsop I realised the portrait was AI because the hands were gooey, (AI cant render hands accurately.... yet ) then the penny dropped. .
Its possible he passed his own base photo through an AI generator just like using a filter
Top of TT this week is an image put through an app, it's AI, using a photogger's base image, but still AI. People download cartoons from social media to their feed here, ( and many more fav them so they get on PP!).
AI is a tool many more will adopt as an art form and it be as acceptable as Snapseed, Photoshop, Ribbet, Affinity etc al.
My issue is only about denial and dishonesty. A few questioned him about it and got their comments deleted, that is not the spirit of this site in my eyes :-(
I didn't actually follow him I just saw some of his photos but I think he did follow me briefly.
@30pics4jackiesdiamond I think the photo you mentioned as being on the top of the TT this week was mine. I did take the original photo and then played with it in photo fun. I think the link is https://funny.pho.to/amazing-photo-frames/
and I mentioned that when I posted the photo.
I posted other photos in pho.to fun too and gave a link to the original photo.
I hope you don't think I was trying to deceive anyone with my photos.
That would be the last thing I would do
I occasionally play with my photos in photoshop using Gavin Hoey's tutorials too and I always give a link as to how to do them. ie Little Planet, Mirror Boxes and 3D orbs all using Gavin's tutorials.
I don't have a problem with AI but as everyone here says it should be recognised as such.
I do enjoy looking at some of the creative photos on this site and the fact that people share how they are created too. It is an amazing site and I have been here a long time.
I might add that I don't think Photoshop is AI it is just a tool to play with my photos, but I do recognise that Pho.to fun is a form of AI using my photo. which is why I add the link.
I too love faffing and have learned so much through the links you pass on, thanks fo doing that :-)
I saw two of my screenshots photos in FB way back,the person who copied them used to be here on 365..( now her acct.deleted) I confronted her and she doesn’t give a f**knmn😡such a KAREN!!
After all, we are just normal human beings following a passion. It is such a pleasure seeing something we would like to share with friends, knowing that they appreciate the moment. Most of us are in the same boat, and this site is the perfect way to show what you love about mother nature.
I have no problem with anyone who sees it different, just say what and why you are doing what you do.🙏🏼
Photographers have always manipulated images, whether it's filters screwed onto the front of lenses, or dodging and burning in the b&w darkroom. AI allows you to instruct the program, your creativity is not involved - you don't even need to supply an original image to produce something - it just pulls images out of the cloud - images that could have been "scraped" by a bot from any image sharing site. I apply techniques to MY work, Corinne C put on a beautified squirrel yesterday, John Falconer put up the AI surreal couple, we all fiddle around with WWYD, there's the In the Darkroom group - and loads of you accept a challenge to develop your skills and widen your understanding. But the thing is, WE put in the work. Where is the value if eg @30pics4jackiesdiamond had simply typed in "give me a chopped vegetable flying through the air" ??
Wish I'd concentrated more in English Language lessons a century ago at school to be more articulate.
I am having to resort to more Photoshop photos like little planets and also I play with Pho.to fun occasionally at the moment because I can't walk far. I am 75 years old and for the first time in my life I am feeling old. It will get better when I am mobile again. Hope we are still friends because I love your photos and comments. I see it is your birthday too, so Happy Birthday, but I won't sing, you don't want to hear me sing. I could bake you a cake though. ha ha.
Used to refer to an overly demanding or entitled middle-class woman.
A “Karen” is generally depicted as a high-strung, rude woman. A common example is when someone is rude or abrasive towards customer service workers, this person might be called a Karen.
https://www.tiktok.com/@blairimani/video/7265066236927675690?lang=en
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karen_(slang)#:~:text=Karen%20is%20a%20term%20used,to%20demand%20their%20own%20way%22.
Of course I use Photoshop and other apps to try and improve my photos. I am old, shaky and need a bit of help 😁
I love this group and am delighted to be part of it 😍
I think I need to change my name! 😆 This is definitely not a name I'm too thrilled to be the owner of if that's what it all implies (in the various links).
Thankfully not - that would really motivate me to take a trip to the lawyers to do some serious name changes 😂
Interesting subject you’ve raised here; I am no fan of the blatant misuse of AI. I know AI is now prevalent in just about all editing apps, Lightroom included, and I have no problem with AI helping me mask a subject or the sky in order to enable me to fix the lighting or colour or do whatever other fixit-editing work; but when folk use midjourney and enter a couple of prompts, come up with a good-looking image entirely from prompts alone and lead others to believe it to be a photograph they captured; that is something I have serious issues with. It’s a blatant lie - why lie about something like this?
And it’s actually quite troubling, this whole AI business; I’ve sometimes got to the point whereby I seriously question the originality of an image. Is this for real, or is it a very cleverly done AI piece of photographic-looking art? Or someone else’s image they swiped off the internet and dollied up with AI? Some folk are very good at it, they know how to make an AI piece look really authentically photographic.
It’s a complex subject - it’ll be interesting to see how it all pans out over the coming months/years.
Sorry for the long post; I tend to ramble on and on.
(ps - I hope this is not what ‘karens’ are prone to doing! 🤣 )
Spot on, Annie-Sue. My thoughts and feelings entirely.
Either way a name to be proud of.
No, no reason other than that I think just don't know what Im doing in these settings - when I look at my profile, I see stuff. Mind you, there's not much there to begin with - but let me fiddle around and see what I've gone and switched off when it should be on.
Ive just set project privacy to public to all - hope that does the trick.
Actually, thinking further, when I'm off photo-mode and quit the photography thing for a bit, not posting much - there are times when I set everything to private. It's just a small thing I have about public forums, and oftentimes when I start posting again, I forget about these settings and don't remember what I've changed, and what's showing and what isn't.
Thank you for this most interesting information! The Karen people in the wiki article make for absorbing reading. Who would've thought there's an ethnic group of folk called Karen? Fascinating. I so much appreciated reading this, thank you!
And yes, Karen Carpenter. She's one of the legendary people in the music world one just never forgets about. Fabulous voice, and a wonderful countenance about her.